Blew my HEADGASKET :(
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whose meth car had engine failure? I dont recall seeing any so far.
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It's just someone made a valid point (but I don't know what is involved in Rod Job) they stated what is the point of going so far and taking a short cut, what if there is an issue with base gasket because it has already previously been compressed.
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Just found out that my headgasket has blow out today
I took my car to a local shop because of a oil leak coming from the head area on the drivers side toward the front of the car. The car seemed to be running just fine but felt like it was a little down on power lately. Shop has told me that is has been blown for a while now! You could actually feel the exhaust coming out of the gasket with your fingers while the car was idling!
So, I need some options on what to do to it while it is out without getting too crazy $$. I have already purchase the EVO 10mm head studs (thanks Sharky!) and have been thinking of doing rods but that gets pretty spendy! I was told that the guides are all done for and that I might need new valves too $$.
Car was run at 1.4 bar for the past 10K miles with an EPL tune and meth. Before that it was on a Proto tune for 20K miles. I am thinking that the studs just stretched out over time? They do have over 30K of abuse on them? There were no signs of detonation. Car has 55K on it now.
I took my car to a local shop because of a oil leak coming from the head area on the drivers side toward the front of the car. The car seemed to be running just fine but felt like it was a little down on power lately. Shop has told me that is has been blown for a while now! You could actually feel the exhaust coming out of the gasket with your fingers while the car was idling!So, I need some options on what to do to it while it is out without getting too crazy $$. I have already purchase the EVO 10mm head studs (thanks Sharky!) and have been thinking of doing rods but that gets pretty spendy! I was told that the guides are all done for and that I might need new valves too $$.
Car was run at 1.4 bar for the past 10K miles with an EPL tune and meth. Before that it was on a Proto tune for 20K miles. I am thinking that the studs just stretched out over time? They do have over 30K of abuse on them? There were no signs of detonation. Car has 55K on it now.
That really sucks to hear, bro.
Out of curiosity, is this the first time you noticed the leak? Also, you didn't notice a change in the sound of your exhaust at all?
I'm not sharp-shooting, just wondering since leaks and sounds are usually pretty noticeable in a case like this.
Last, if you have to go into the motor, I would say to definitely do both rods and studs. Good luck.
Last edited by Divexxtreme; Dec 18, 2009 at 06:54 AM.
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Not sure who installed the meth kit, but this guy was also running one when his car blew: https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...-my-motor.html
Don,
The last I heard, the blown head gasket was diagnosed using a hand "feel" for air being by passed through the gasket (I can even see how this is possible). I hope more steps where taken to actually diagnose the car before it was taken a part?
What were the leakage numbers? Compression? Im still skeptical.
Let me know how we can help.
The last I heard, the blown head gasket was diagnosed using a hand "feel" for air being by passed through the gasket (I can even see how this is possible). I hope more steps where taken to actually diagnose the car before it was taken a part?
What were the leakage numbers? Compression? Im still skeptical.
Let me know how we can help.
This car had a lowend water injection system with no fail safe. The tune that was in the car wasnt much, if at all more aggressive then a pump gas tune. As Don stated, there were no signs of detonation, hence no correlation to the meth.
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okay, so a headgasket that has failed so bad that you can feel the exhaust pulses by your hand would be spewing fluid all over and be leaking also.
now if your Lifting your heads(under boost) you can see the mark of black soot as it lifts the head and exhaust rushes out, on the engine cases around where the heads seat. you will also see old and new antifreeze puking out n running down the engine block.
okay assuming its not a misdiagnosis and the gasket is blown. if its blown and has been for any length of time the water and exhaust pressures rushing back n fourth over the machine surfaces of the block and head are likely going to need to be machined and at that point a full tear down of the engine is in order. make your choices here wisely there are a few people who have done this multiple times asa result.
if your going to tear the engine apart to deck the block and heads to be smooth for a new gasket you might as well o ring the block to prevent failure in the future this is a cost effective option, saves failure in the future. now that you have the block apart some things you should do is replace the oil pump, and check the bottom end out especially rods. they can be bent and you not know it or cracked n ready to fail hence quoting S-351's build.
Pauter rods are a good option and dont need to notch the oil pump, carrilos are stronger but require a lil bit more machine work in some cases(might have changed recently but i doubt it) atleast have the whole assembly balanced with flyweel for the future the cost at machinist is minimal.
remember the actual parts of the build are the cheap side the labor is what is really costly the motor build is a 100hr build remove replace and heat cycle remove retorque replace again (another 51hrs) remember that the camshafts have to come out of the motor to retorque the head studs. Jags im sure can comment on this from previous experience. ARP is not a bad fastener if the specs are followed but it doesn't mean they are the best options, Race wear has an option that has been working well for a few of the top engine builds running around and reliable.
Remember if you half *** this the first time and do it twice thats double the labor and when labor is 10k rough figure think long and hard about this.
there are aot of people who say they can build a motor for you, but do some research here dont rush in, Pick a builder that does not have a reputation for not answering your phone calls after the check clears. Pick a builder who is more interested in you then marketing their product. Pick someone who will stand behind their work and not tell you sorry for you that your 25k motor build didn't do what you wanted.
Look at whos motors have been running around with no problems for years and still running strong not ones that are shop cars that get torn apart many times.
so weve now covred what you can expect when you open the motor assuming the heads are not in ill shape other then decking and your pistons n oter things are A-Okay now you have rods 2k give or take , oil pump600-1000$ new bottom end bearings500$, assembly time approximately 50hrs from a seasoned pro for assembly( do remember there are not many people who can do this properly this is not an average motor) then machine work for block and heads about 2k deending on where you go for a full 0-ring setup and then head stud price. if your heads need rebuilding 1500-3000 all new misc gaskets roughly 1500$ and then the rest of the labor to remove and reinstall the motor 50hr aproximately then you heat cycle break it in assuming you put in new rings and stock pistons then the motor comes back out for a retorque and the cams have to be removed and basically most of the motor disassembled approx 51 hrs. The people that dont o ring and dont retorque generally do it over.
so without parts you just hit 15k in labor assuming 100$ an hr to do it right the first time. if you do it twice cause you half assed it the first time you will pay 20-25k and much more heache in labor alone.
there is a few builders who will recomend not to do a retorque but that is taking a chance unlesss its O ringed then its subjective i can tell you ill retorque it as i dont have the money to do it twice.
make sure your builder will stand behind the fact that this will hold and not lift the heads again or you do it twice and costs way more yet again.
ive done quite a bit of research on this and talked to alot of builders give me a ring and we can chat some more.
there are a few shops around that can build you a proper motor and can let you sleep at night.
i can tell you that the previous owner of my car spent 18k ona rods only rebuild with no retorque and ill be doing it again cause they didn't do it right the first time. And the company that built all the perfomrance parts on the car wont bother to take the time to answer questions to their own parts and the turbo upgrades cost more then the motor rebuild did
some other items that have been recommended are the vario cam adjusters on the heads when rebuilding but they are not cheap but they are a problem there 1k each aprroximately
be sure to get a written quote and agree on everything ahead of time n make the shop stick to it so you dont get hit with extra costs that add up really fast.
William
now if your Lifting your heads(under boost) you can see the mark of black soot as it lifts the head and exhaust rushes out, on the engine cases around where the heads seat. you will also see old and new antifreeze puking out n running down the engine block.
okay assuming its not a misdiagnosis and the gasket is blown. if its blown and has been for any length of time the water and exhaust pressures rushing back n fourth over the machine surfaces of the block and head are likely going to need to be machined and at that point a full tear down of the engine is in order. make your choices here wisely there are a few people who have done this multiple times asa result.
if your going to tear the engine apart to deck the block and heads to be smooth for a new gasket you might as well o ring the block to prevent failure in the future this is a cost effective option, saves failure in the future. now that you have the block apart some things you should do is replace the oil pump, and check the bottom end out especially rods. they can be bent and you not know it or cracked n ready to fail hence quoting S-351's build.
Pauter rods are a good option and dont need to notch the oil pump, carrilos are stronger but require a lil bit more machine work in some cases(might have changed recently but i doubt it) atleast have the whole assembly balanced with flyweel for the future the cost at machinist is minimal.
remember the actual parts of the build are the cheap side the labor is what is really costly the motor build is a 100hr build remove replace and heat cycle remove retorque replace again (another 51hrs) remember that the camshafts have to come out of the motor to retorque the head studs. Jags im sure can comment on this from previous experience. ARP is not a bad fastener if the specs are followed but it doesn't mean they are the best options, Race wear has an option that has been working well for a few of the top engine builds running around and reliable.
Remember if you half *** this the first time and do it twice thats double the labor and when labor is 10k rough figure think long and hard about this.
there are aot of people who say they can build a motor for you, but do some research here dont rush in, Pick a builder that does not have a reputation for not answering your phone calls after the check clears. Pick a builder who is more interested in you then marketing their product. Pick someone who will stand behind their work and not tell you sorry for you that your 25k motor build didn't do what you wanted.
Look at whos motors have been running around with no problems for years and still running strong not ones that are shop cars that get torn apart many times.
so weve now covred what you can expect when you open the motor assuming the heads are not in ill shape other then decking and your pistons n oter things are A-Okay now you have rods 2k give or take , oil pump600-1000$ new bottom end bearings500$, assembly time approximately 50hrs from a seasoned pro for assembly( do remember there are not many people who can do this properly this is not an average motor) then machine work for block and heads about 2k deending on where you go for a full 0-ring setup and then head stud price. if your heads need rebuilding 1500-3000 all new misc gaskets roughly 1500$ and then the rest of the labor to remove and reinstall the motor 50hr aproximately then you heat cycle break it in assuming you put in new rings and stock pistons then the motor comes back out for a retorque and the cams have to be removed and basically most of the motor disassembled approx 51 hrs. The people that dont o ring and dont retorque generally do it over.
so without parts you just hit 15k in labor assuming 100$ an hr to do it right the first time. if you do it twice cause you half assed it the first time you will pay 20-25k and much more heache in labor alone.
there is a few builders who will recomend not to do a retorque but that is taking a chance unlesss its O ringed then its subjective i can tell you ill retorque it as i dont have the money to do it twice.
make sure your builder will stand behind the fact that this will hold and not lift the heads again or you do it twice and costs way more yet again.
ive done quite a bit of research on this and talked to alot of builders give me a ring and we can chat some more.
there are a few shops around that can build you a proper motor and can let you sleep at night.
i can tell you that the previous owner of my car spent 18k ona rods only rebuild with no retorque and ill be doing it again cause they didn't do it right the first time. And the company that built all the perfomrance parts on the car wont bother to take the time to answer questions to their own parts and the turbo upgrades cost more then the motor rebuild did
some other items that have been recommended are the vario cam adjusters on the heads when rebuilding but they are not cheap but they are a problem there 1k each aprroximately
be sure to get a written quote and agree on everything ahead of time n make the shop stick to it so you dont get hit with extra costs that add up really fast.
William
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Props for a great post!
okay, so a headgasket that has failed so bad that you can feel the exhaust pulses by your hand would be spewing fluid all over and be leaking also.
now if your Lifting your heads(under boost) you can see the mark of black soot as it lifts the head and exhaust rushes out, on the engine cases around where the heads seat. you will also see old and new antifreeze puking out n running down the engine block.
okay assuming its not a misdiagnosis and the gasket is blown. if its blown and has been for any length of time the water and exhaust pressures rushing back n fourth over the machine surfaces of the block and head are likely going to need to be machined and at that point a full tear down of the engine is in order. make your choices here wisely there are a few people who have done this multiple times asa result.
if your going to tear the engine apart to deck the block and heads to be smooth for a new gasket you might as well o ring the block to prevent failure in the future this is a cost effective option, saves failure in the future. now that you have the block apart some things you should do is replace the oil pump, and check the bottom end out especially rods. they can be bent and you not know it or cracked n ready to fail hence quoting S-351's build.
Pauter rods are a good option and dont need to notch the oil pump, carrilos are stronger but require a lil bit more machine work in some cases(might have changed recently but i doubt it) atleast have the whole assembly balanced with flyweel for the future the cost at machinist is minimal.
remember the actual parts of the build are the cheap side the labor is what is really costly the motor build is a 100hr build remove replace and heat cycle remove retorque replace again (another 51hrs) remember that the camshafts have to come out of the motor to retorque the head studs. Jags im sure can comment on this from previous experience. ARP is not a bad fastener if the specs are followed but it doesn't mean they are the best options, Race wear has an option that has been working well for a few of the top engine builds running around and reliable.
Remember if you half *** this the first time and do it twice thats double the labor and when labor is 10k rough figure think long and hard about this.
there are aot of people who say they can build a motor for you, but do some research here dont rush in, Pick a builder that does not have a reputation for not answering your phone calls after the check clears. Pick a builder who is more interested in you then marketing their product. Pick someone who will stand behind their work and not tell you sorry for you that your 25k motor build didn't do what you wanted.
Look at whos motors have been running around with no problems for years and still running strong not ones that are shop cars that get torn apart many times.
so weve now covred what you can expect when you open the motor assuming the heads are not in ill shape other then decking and your pistons n oter things are A-Okay now you have rods 2k give or take , oil pump600-1000$ new bottom end bearings500$, assembly time approximately 50hrs from a seasoned pro for assembly( do remember there are not many people who can do this properly this is not an average motor) then machine work for block and heads about 2k deending on where you go for a full 0-ring setup and then head stud price. if your heads need rebuilding 1500-3000 all new misc gaskets roughly 1500$ and then the rest of the labor to remove and reinstall the motor 50hr aproximately then you heat cycle break it in assuming you put in new rings and stock pistons then the motor comes back out for a retorque and the cams have to be removed and basically most of the motor disassembled approx 51 hrs. The people that dont o ring and dont retorque generally do it over.
so without parts you just hit 15k in labor assuming 100$ an hr to do it right the first time. if you do it twice cause you half assed it the first time you will pay 20-25k and much more heache in labor alone.
there is a few builders who will recomend not to do a retorque but that is taking a chance unlesss its O ringed then its subjective i can tell you ill retorque it as i dont have the money to do it twice.
make sure your builder will stand behind the fact that this will hold and not lift the heads again or you do it twice and costs way more yet again.
ive done quite a bit of research on this and talked to alot of builders give me a ring and we can chat some more.
there are a few shops around that can build you a proper motor and can let you sleep at night.
i can tell you that the previous owner of my car spent 18k ona rods only rebuild with no retorque and ill be doing it again cause they didn't do it right the first time. And the company that built all the perfomrance parts on the car wont bother to take the time to answer questions to their own parts and the turbo upgrades cost more then the motor rebuild did
some other items that have been recommended are the vario cam adjusters on the heads when rebuilding but they are not cheap but they are a problem there 1k each aprroximately
be sure to get a written quote and agree on everything ahead of time n make the shop stick to it so you dont get hit with extra costs that add up really fast.
William
now if your Lifting your heads(under boost) you can see the mark of black soot as it lifts the head and exhaust rushes out, on the engine cases around where the heads seat. you will also see old and new antifreeze puking out n running down the engine block.
okay assuming its not a misdiagnosis and the gasket is blown. if its blown and has been for any length of time the water and exhaust pressures rushing back n fourth over the machine surfaces of the block and head are likely going to need to be machined and at that point a full tear down of the engine is in order. make your choices here wisely there are a few people who have done this multiple times asa result.
if your going to tear the engine apart to deck the block and heads to be smooth for a new gasket you might as well o ring the block to prevent failure in the future this is a cost effective option, saves failure in the future. now that you have the block apart some things you should do is replace the oil pump, and check the bottom end out especially rods. they can be bent and you not know it or cracked n ready to fail hence quoting S-351's build.
Pauter rods are a good option and dont need to notch the oil pump, carrilos are stronger but require a lil bit more machine work in some cases(might have changed recently but i doubt it) atleast have the whole assembly balanced with flyweel for the future the cost at machinist is minimal.
remember the actual parts of the build are the cheap side the labor is what is really costly the motor build is a 100hr build remove replace and heat cycle remove retorque replace again (another 51hrs) remember that the camshafts have to come out of the motor to retorque the head studs. Jags im sure can comment on this from previous experience. ARP is not a bad fastener if the specs are followed but it doesn't mean they are the best options, Race wear has an option that has been working well for a few of the top engine builds running around and reliable.
Remember if you half *** this the first time and do it twice thats double the labor and when labor is 10k rough figure think long and hard about this.
there are aot of people who say they can build a motor for you, but do some research here dont rush in, Pick a builder that does not have a reputation for not answering your phone calls after the check clears. Pick a builder who is more interested in you then marketing their product. Pick someone who will stand behind their work and not tell you sorry for you that your 25k motor build didn't do what you wanted.
Look at whos motors have been running around with no problems for years and still running strong not ones that are shop cars that get torn apart many times.
so weve now covred what you can expect when you open the motor assuming the heads are not in ill shape other then decking and your pistons n oter things are A-Okay now you have rods 2k give or take , oil pump600-1000$ new bottom end bearings500$, assembly time approximately 50hrs from a seasoned pro for assembly( do remember there are not many people who can do this properly this is not an average motor) then machine work for block and heads about 2k deending on where you go for a full 0-ring setup and then head stud price. if your heads need rebuilding 1500-3000 all new misc gaskets roughly 1500$ and then the rest of the labor to remove and reinstall the motor 50hr aproximately then you heat cycle break it in assuming you put in new rings and stock pistons then the motor comes back out for a retorque and the cams have to be removed and basically most of the motor disassembled approx 51 hrs. The people that dont o ring and dont retorque generally do it over.
so without parts you just hit 15k in labor assuming 100$ an hr to do it right the first time. if you do it twice cause you half assed it the first time you will pay 20-25k and much more heache in labor alone.
there is a few builders who will recomend not to do a retorque but that is taking a chance unlesss its O ringed then its subjective i can tell you ill retorque it as i dont have the money to do it twice.
make sure your builder will stand behind the fact that this will hold and not lift the heads again or you do it twice and costs way more yet again.
ive done quite a bit of research on this and talked to alot of builders give me a ring and we can chat some more.
there are a few shops around that can build you a proper motor and can let you sleep at night.
i can tell you that the previous owner of my car spent 18k ona rods only rebuild with no retorque and ill be doing it again cause they didn't do it right the first time. And the company that built all the perfomrance parts on the car wont bother to take the time to answer questions to their own parts and the turbo upgrades cost more then the motor rebuild did
some other items that have been recommended are the vario cam adjusters on the heads when rebuilding but they are not cheap but they are a problem there 1k each aprroximately
be sure to get a written quote and agree on everything ahead of time n make the shop stick to it so you dont get hit with extra costs that add up really fast.
William