996 Turbo / GT2 Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2005 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2.

Wavetrac LSD VS Guard 60/40??

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Old Feb 2, 2014 | 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Fadi
dont know about Guard, but Wavetrack did magic to my car... one of the best mods and i did almost all of them! night and day from a dig, in 1st and 2nd gear even using R888 traction is improved a lot, better control in twisty roads too... i have a quaife on my bmw 335i ( about 500 hp crank ) and i feel wavetrack changed the 996 more than quaife did on the 335i, i have to admit the power level and delivery is also different as 996 turbos hit much much harder and maybe thats a good reason, anyway.. wavetrack does its job very well for me and i am a happy driver using it
just so i am clear?? you are currently running it in your 96t?? thanks....
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 01:10 PM
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yes, i am running it !
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Fadi
yes, i am running it !
excellent, thanks! i noticed you said it was a major improvement in twisties, and that is exactly what i seek. it's highly possible this would be a good choice for me as i'm not tracking and i'll rarely have one or more wheels off the ground.

at least not if i can help it
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 01:33 PM
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just as a reference the diff i sent to unitrax was a normal rwd independent suspension unit. i removed it and shipped it to them and they installed the wavetrac for 225$ and shipped it back to me.
if you pull the trans and drain the fluid i doubt the install by them would be much more labor wise.

one thing i wonder about and haven't asked yet is the wavetrac specifically requires a diff fluid that has NO friction modifiers in the oil. i don't know what is in the mobil1 oil i use from lufteknic but auto tech recommends a motul diff oil for the wavetrac. don't know how that will work with the rest of the gearbox
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 01:39 PM
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i noticed that. specifically to avoid redline or any oil w lsd "additives" whatever those are, i have no idea but i'm sure thats what you're saying

motul 300 over redline, how much difference can there be? or is it the viscosity breakdown thing. what is motul 75/140!? i would think the 75/90 would be fine with all other parts.
 

Last edited by '02996ttx50; Feb 2, 2014 at 01:43 PM.
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by '02996ttx50
i noticed that. specifically to avoid redline or any oil w lsd "additives" whatever those are, i have no idea but i'm sure thats what you're saying

motul 300 over redline, how much difference can there be? or is it the viscosity breakdown thing. what is motul 75/140!? i would think the 75/90 would be fine with all other parts.
additives or friction modifiers
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/...tion-modifiers

specifically they don't want to add slickness to the oil to add slippage to the gears. mogul 75/140 is the recommended oil for the wavetrac and i don't know how that will work with the transmission as they share the same oil. I'm sure devin at unitary could help with this

the main or biggest difference would be with the warranty. use the wrong oil and you could void it
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by '02996ttx50
excellent, thanks! i noticed you said it was a major improvement in twisties, and that is exactly what i seek. it's highly possible this would be a good choice for me as i'm not tracking and i'll rarely have one or more wheels off the ground.

at least not if i can help it
yes it helps a lot, but i run custom big gt30s and i can not say my car likes twisties too much... maybe 590whp on a dynojet @0.9bar, but these turbos hit very hard and it gets a bit tricky, i am really thinking to put a smaller compressor wheel in there and have more fun
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by 32krazy!
mogul 75/140 is the recommended oil for the wavetrac and i don't know how that will work with the transmission as they share the same oil. I'm sure devin at unitary could help with this

the main or biggest difference would be with the warranty. use the wrong oil and you could void it
i saw that but unless i'm reading their tech stuff wrong? they say motul 75-90 OR the 75-140 is recommended. though NOT redline. the motul 75/90 was on the list of 3 they say is ok though it's all becoming a blur by now


seems the main complaint against using this type ( the torsen bias type ) of "lsd" ( though we agree it isn't *technically a *true* lsd is this: "it has no torque bias in the coast condition and this limits its value for track use" but wavetrac claims otherwise with some degree of lock while coasting?

but then the wavetrac is ( it is claimed ) NOT the traditional torsen bias type lsd!

an informative thread i found on both types @ pelican included some equally dissenting viewpoints not the least of which i found came from matt @ GT. not surprisingly he disdains the use of them on porsche's, while many porsche folks seem to swear by them ( the wavetrac ) on street use, if not while tracking. more grist for the mill and a good read..

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...etrac-lsd.html
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 02:55 PM
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guards.
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by '02996ttx50
i saw that but unless i'm reading their tech stuff wrong? they say motul 75-90 OR the 75-140 is recommended. though NOT redline. the motul 75/90 was on the list of 3 they say is ok though it's all becoming a blur by now


seems the main complaint against using this type ( the torsen bias type ) of "lsd" ( though we agree it isn't *technically a *true* lsd is this: "it has no torque bias in the coast condition and this limits its value for track use" but wavetrac claims otherwise with some degree of lock while coasting?

but then the wavetrac is ( it is claimed ) NOT the traditional torsen bias type lsd!

an informative thread i found on both types @ pelican included some equally dissenting viewpoints not the least of which i found came from matt @ GT. not surprisingly he disdains the use of them on porsche's, while many porsche folks seem to swear by them ( the wavetrac ) on street use, if not while tracking. more grist for the mill and a good read..

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...etrac-lsd.html
redline must have modifiers in it thus the warning not to use it. and oddly enough the disdain guard has for the tbd must not be huge as they sell it!
http://www.guardtransmissionllc.com/...differentials/
 

Last edited by 32krazy!; Feb 2, 2014 at 02:59 PM.
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 03:02 PM
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wow. that's a find..wonder if they have been ( torque ) converted

the more i learn, the more i feel this could be right for my intended app.
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by 32krazy!
redline must have modifiers in it thus the warning not to use it. and oddly enough the disdain guard has for the tbd must not be huge as they sell it!
http://www.guardtransmissionllc.com/...differentials/
Guard will sell you a TBD if you really really want one and are mostly a street guy with some auto crossing thrown in. If you track and or want the best performance out of your diff they will recommend an LSD 100% of the time. Matt is a straight shooter. He will not BS you.

Mobil 1 Delvac 75/90 does not contain any LSD modifiers and is a popular choice. Standard fill in GT2/3s and Cup cars. This is NOT the same stuff you get at autozone or pep boys. I buy it in 5 gallon pails direct from the local Mobil distributor but you can get it online in 1 gallon jugs.
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by pwdrhound
Guard diff are NOT built from OE housings. OE housings are cast while Guard uses their own much stronger billet housings. I believe that PMNA housings are billet also.
Good to know. I don't know what I was thinking of then.
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by '02996ttx50
wow. that's a find..wonder if they have been ( torque ) converted

the more i learn, the more i feel this could be right for my intended app.
Is that the Wavetrac you are thinking of going with? I will look forward to see how you like it because I think we both use our cars very similarly. Very hard street/canyon driving, which as I found after going to the track with some experienced track guys, is very different from hard track driving. I will likely go to the track again but it is unlikely I will be tracking heavily. If I do it is unlikely it will be in this car, but in a MUCH cheaper dedicated track car.
 
Old Feb 2, 2014 | 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Fadi
yes it helps a lot, but i run custom big gt30s and i can not say my car likes twisties too much... maybe 590whp on a dynojet @0.9bar, but these turbos hit very hard and it gets a bit tricky, i am really thinking to put a smaller compressor wheel in there and have more fun
i hear you! with my old 16/24's setup i feel i'm in the sweet spot for fast canyons, with instant ON. i have no need ( or room on the road! ) for more power.. well, maybe a little couldn't hurt!

but less weight, w better handling and traction is where i'm hopefully heading. since removing the cardan, i have *rediscovered* wheel spin not cool.
 


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