Hi All,
I have had my 996TT for about a year now. I got her bone stock with the mush suspension, mush shifter, and mush clutch. Since then, I have started upgrading her and have addressed two out of the three. I am saving the clutch for when it either needs replacing or the trans comes out for another reason.

So, here is where I would like some input. As a driver, feedback is very important to me. I like to feel/listen to what the car and the road are telling me. It lets me know what is going on with the car and what the limits are. Yesterday I had the chance to drive down a very fun yet not so well maintained road here in AZ. It turned into feedback overload for me. I realized that my car has become too specialized for what I use it for right now. It is set up for smooth roads which tend to be the most boring which causes it to be not very fun at all when you get a chance to find an interesting one.

What I want - Im looking for a good all around car at this point that is as fun to drive on the street as it is during an HPDE. Im willing to sacrifice some of its top limit at the track to keep a smile on my face during all other times. Im trying to find as neutral of a setup as I can so that I can make adjustments as I learn the car better to both suit its characteristics as well as my driving style.

What its setup is right now
Coilovers - Bilstein PSS9 valved by FVD (set at 3F/5R)
Droplinks - Tarret
Wheels - 19x8.5 f, 19x11.5 r
Tires - 235/30/19 f, 315/25/19 r (Toyo Proxes TR1, 95% tread f, 50% tread r)
Ride Height - 25.5" F/R
Alignment - 5mo ago @ factory specs

What my initial plan is
1 - Tires - I am thinking of making the switch to Potenza S-04 PPs. I have heard a lot of really good reviews about them being a very good all around summer tire and that they would be much more versitile than the RE-11s as I have heard they tend to get a little greasy at the limit for extended periods (more of an autox tire). I am looking at getting them in a 225/40/19 f, 305/30/19 r as they have a much closer rev ratio than my current tires and puts the bias towards the rear which wears out faster so it will first move towards a zero ratio and then past rather than the fronts which just move further away from zero as the rear wears.
2 - Ride Height - Due to the fact that the new tires are going to be a little over half an inch taller than what I have now, I will at least need to raise my suspension by 1/4 to keep the same fender gap. I am thinking of possibly raising another 1/4 above that (total of 26" height) to allow for a bit more travel. I am hoping that this will make it a little more complaint on less than stellar road surfaces
3 - Tarett Toe Links - Even though the car is within factory specs, my worry is that it is still toeing out in certain conditions. I feel that its not a lot of money to get these and the locking plates and I will basically get that back in more even tire wear and greater car enjoyment

I will probably get a set of sways down the road once I feel that I actually need them.

Based on what I have listed above, what are your thoughts? Should I be moving towards a custom alignment with these settings or stick closer to stock? Is there anything that I am missing here?
*Assume that all parts are in good working order right now.

 

S04 has way less grip than a re-11 has but if you want a better all around street tire the S04 is pretty good. As for sizes, personally I'd go for a 245/35/19 front over the 225/40/19. Guys run them with the 305/30/19 rear with no issues as far as I've read with awd. Much better handling. If you want to do some work, you can fit 255/35/19 in the front but you have to mod the front radiator bracket.

 

Ive run RE-11s and Azenis before and loved them for what they were but they start to lean towards a more specialized tire. I am looking for something that will be happy spending 80-90% of its time on the street with the remainder on an occasional HPDE. If I went more track heavy with the car I would just go with slicks anyway. Im to the point where Im not looking for optimal 'spreadsheet' performance but rather performance that is optimal for me.

 

If I were you I would play with the damping settings first. You are set pretty stiff for poor roads. I would go up a couple click on each end and see how it feels. When I got my car it was full stiff (1) and road like a fork truck. I put them to full soft and worked my way stiffer over a couple of weeks until it was firm but tolerable. I do not remember where I ended up. If this feels good enough it will save you more work and the cost of an alignment. If you live in Arizona I am sure you don't really know a bad road. Come and visit northern Indiana. You'llsell your car and buy a 1990s Buick. ;-)

I have s04 in 245/35 and 305/ 30 19 and I really like them. My car had hankook v12 evo2 in factory sizes when I bought it. The s04 ride much better and have way more grip. I think for the money they are a great tire. No rubbing either.

 

I have only been in AZ for a year and lived in NYC for almost a decade before that so I know all too well what a crappy road feels like. I think I got my settings mixed up and its 5f/3r. I will try them out at 7/5 and see what that is like. I dont like going full soft with coilovers as they tend to get much more bouncy.

Dont have to worry about an alignment though. I have a lifetime at Firestone and they can work on lowered cars I need to raise it anyway due to the increased sidewall height of the tires though. Thanks for the feedback on the S04s though. Its looking more and more like they will be my next tire.

 

Have you thought about doing a more aggressive alignment. I went with an alignment based on gt2 specs. I'm running -1.1 camber up front -1.8 rear, zero toe up front and slight toe in rear. Feels great!!!

 

Yep. Going to do it with everyone else. While it might make the car a little more stable at speed, I dont think it will get rid of the over feedback Im getting. I need to have the car dampened a little more for regular roads. The sensitivity might work great on a track where generally you get a smooth service and it gives you the chance to notice minor changes, its just too much on the street. Im hoping that adding just a little height, reducing the settings on the shocks and adding a tire with a bit more beef will help in that regards.

 

I think I get what you want. I'd dump the 19's and go back to 18" on the wheels. The car was made for this, the wheels and tire combo will generally be lighter, have less unsprung weight which is extremely important for overall handling, quick directional changes, quick braking and everything else related to feedback, steering and handling. 19's were all about looks at the expense of everything else.

Tires in reality are probably the least important for street duty. If you are on a closed course and racing for money and you had already done everything else including maximizing your driving skills I agree, tires are important. For what you are doing, I think it will make little difference. Very smooth drivers can make poor tires work amazingly well.

Suspension set up, particularly your compression and rebound dampening will make the difference between being able to stay in your lane or not at speeds up to or over 130 to 150+ MPH on a back country 2 lane road. Many of these roads or highways were really made for 50 MPH and lack proper road base. Winter frost, summer sun, settling and such create side to side and fore and aft variances in what initially appear a fairly smooth road. As speeds increase, the left to right un-eveness, dips and rises become more and more apparent. If the car is a bit overly sprung and dampened, the suspension wants to kick back a bit instead of absorbing the shocks. This is where an adjustable suspension shines. All that's required is trial and error or knowledge in setting it up, knowing what's needed and clicking away.

As far as sway bars and other things like rake, toe adjustments, etc. Keep driving, changing dampening and spring preload if you have that, tire air pressure too and you will get closer and closer to your goals. Ultimately, you may want to go RWD only to get the classic 911 experience.

Finally, keep driving these roads and make mental notes of the problems you are having, be as specific as possible. Then look for solutions. Example: the car pushes when trying to enter a turn. Fix: fit a stiffer rear sway bar.

 

Totally agree with nick49, in all my research with wheel size always swayed me away from larger than stock rims. I have PSS10's that I couldn't initially get quite right until I installed Adjustable Eibach anti sway bars. This combination has totally transformed my car, car handles and feels much better. The sways added a bit more stiffness but I found once I adjusted (softer) my shocks it all came together very nicely.

 

Thanks all!

Im not going to be able to go back to 18s just yet due to room and the fact that my stock hollow spoke twists are chrome (bleh). As far as tires, Im not so much looking for ability at the limit but rather their behavior during driving. Sure, you can maximize a cheap tire but the tread isnt the only thing that causes it to be cheap.

I will try the adjustment to the shock settings first and then see how that plays and go from there. If I ultimately need to go back to an 18, I will.

 

I don't remember what wheels you are running su_maverick? If they are heavier than stock, yes that would impact performance due to more unsprung weight.

Plus one wheel sizes is nothing new and if done properly are not an issue. I am running 19" wheels and they are just about the same weight as OEM Hollow Twists and considerably lighter than non-hollow OEM Twists. I am also running the stock sidewall height because I am running 225/40 front and 295/30 rear. Since sidewall height is exactly the same as on stock 18" wheels I have the same comfort on the street as a stock setup as well as zero issues with awd system.

If you run heavy 19" wheels with extremely low profile tires of course performance and ride comfort will suffer. If you run 19's with very light wheels and perfectly selected profiles you can have your cake and eat it too.

Here are my 19" wheel weights VS oem twists:

Factory 996 Turbo Solids
8x18" at 26 lbs 2 oz
11x18" at 31 lbs 6 oz

Factory 996 Turbo Hollows
8x18" at 22 lbs 2oz
11x18" at 26 lbs 5 oz

OZ Formula HLT (actual weight below, I weighed them)
8.5x19" at 22 lbs 5.8 oz
11x19" at 25 lbs 2.8 oz

 

I have SSR GT3's on. Not the lightest but also not a heavyweight compared to some.

F - 8.5x19 - 26lbs
R - 11.sx19 - around 30/31

So basically they are in line with non hollows as far as weight. I think going to a larger sidewall than I have might give some of the comfort back as well. I think my main issue is the shock adjustments as far as feedback is concerned. Its just not absorbing the small variations in road surface like I need it to as its setup right now.

 

Just wanted to update this thread if anybody runs into issues with this later.

I ended up adjusting the PSS9s a bit and softened them to 8 front and 6 rear. I might stiffen up later on but it definitely is less darty on the road now and Im getting less feedback from road imperfections.

 

Yeah I had to revise mine as well I guess I am getting soft in my old age. I am at 7 f and 5 r. Good to hear that you don't have to spend any more time and effort on other tweaks.

 

Thanks! Yeah, Im just very particular about what I want to the car to feel like. Im a little bit of a perfectionist when it comes to my suspension so it drives me bonkers if its off. I got my IS300 dialed in and I havent touched the settings in 4 years.