996 Turbo / GT2 Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2005 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2.

Too much torque for circuit racing after engine rebuild?

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Old Aug 7, 2016 | 03:03 PM
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Too much torque for circuit racing after engine rebuild?

Spend my time on race tracks with a modified 996 Turbo RWD. It is driven on the very limit always.

Engine setup is K24/18G turbos with big injectors, GT2RS ic's, better rods etc. Nothing fancy, an old school proven setup.

Previously tune was approx 575hp/789Nm (582 ft lbs torque). I raced it for years.

After engine rebuild now bit more boost and car has approx 610hp/860Nm (634 ft lbs torque).

I find the car now increasingly more difficult to drive on tracks due to bigger mid range punch the car has now. I am losing the rear aggressively much more and much faster than before. Am I just driving it way too aggressive?

The mid range seems to hit very aggressively, today the car has at around 4000-4500rpm around 40hp and 80Nm (60 ft lbs torque) more than before and seems I am in trouble with it.

Should I consider a retune for less mid-range punch? Can it be done without losing top-end power? Or, should I just adjust my very aggressive driving...

I would dream to have a setup of 600hp-650hp max power (more power than today) and 800Nm max torque (590 ft lbs, so less torque than today) with my current hardware, that should be more driveable and faster. The figures shown are from the flywheel btw.

Any comments? I find it sad I can't handle it now. I drive on the limit and push competitively for lap times. Perhaps I just have to take it easy and adjust the accelerator but it is not a fast way to take it slow with K24 generation turbos when time attack driving is on your focus.

Sorry I don't have a dyno chart comparison but you should get the point. And yes the suspension is all uniball, adjustable shocks and aggressive alignment. Tires used are Pirelli Trofeo R.
 
Old Aug 7, 2016 | 03:30 PM
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ECU re-tune and/or loosing the wastegates a bit can help smooth the spool/torque hit
 
Old Aug 7, 2016 | 03:37 PM
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I think an aftermarket boost controller could help you out a ton.
 
Old Aug 7, 2016 | 04:18 PM
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Thanks guys for your fast replying!

Rpm&gear adjustable aftermarket boost controller would be perfect. How to learn about those for these cars?
 

Last edited by Kaizu; Aug 7, 2016 at 04:43 PM.
Old Aug 7, 2016 | 04:55 PM
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Plex Tuning boost controller, works best imo. let me know if you need more info. can add also a lot of custom logic to it just like a stand-alone ecu and racing dash display.

I am targeting less boost in the middle rpms, as I have lost badly the car from the same reason
 
Old Aug 7, 2016 | 06:55 PM
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Post you dyno for comparison Kai. My engine is at +670wtq at 4000rpm which is about 750 ft.lb at the flywheel using a 10% loss. Your 634 ft.lb at the flywheel should not be an issue. With K24s your midrange should be a good bit softer. I found my car a bit of a handful but learned to drive around it with careful modulation of the throttle. Ever since I switched from 245/305s to 275/335s, car has become infinitely easier to drive because of the increased level of grip, making it downright docile. You have 3 choices Kai, learn to live with it, detune the engine for less midrange torque, increase tire grip, or a combination of the three. If I recall, your car is also set up a bit looser which makes the mid range punch even tricker. In my opinion, you are also getting to the point where the geometry of the front AWD uprights is beginning to show it's shortcomings as you are pushing the car to the edge where it is starting to feel a little nervous mid turn. What tires and sizes are you using? You might also try a larger wing that what you're using. This will help plant the rear better. I just increase the angle of my wing and in combination with the 335s it really glues down the rear end. What LSD are you using, what ramps and what preload? I recently had mine reshimmed to an 80lb preload and it makes a huge difference. Stock GT2 preload is about 7.5lbs which is rather laughable. Good luck...

[url=https://flic.kr/p/vqFY49]
 

Last edited by pwdrhound; Aug 7, 2016 at 07:29 PM.
Old Aug 11, 2016 | 07:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaizu
Spend my time on race tracks with a modified 996 Turbo RWD. It is driven on the very limit always.

Engine setup is K24/18G turbos with big injectors, GT2RS ic's, better rods etc. Nothing fancy, an old school proven setup.

Previously tune was approx 575hp/789Nm (582 ft lbs torque). I raced it for years.

After engine rebuild now bit more boost and car has approx 610hp/860Nm (634 ft lbs torque).

I find the car now increasingly more difficult to drive on tracks due to bigger mid range punch the car has now. I am losing the rear aggressively much more and much faster than before. Am I just driving it way too aggressive?

The mid range seems to hit very aggressively, today the car has at around 4000-4500rpm around 40hp and 80Nm (60 ft lbs torque) more than before and seems I am in trouble with it.

Should I consider a retune for less mid-range punch? Can it be done without losing top-end power? Or, should I just adjust my very aggressive driving...

I would dream to have a setup of 600hp-650hp max power (more power than today) and 800Nm max torque (590 ft lbs, so less torque than today) with my current hardware, that should be more driveable and faster. The figures shown are from the flywheel btw.

Any comments? I find it sad I can't handle it now. I drive on the limit and push competitively for lap times. Perhaps I just have to take it easy and adjust the accelerator but it is not a fast way to take it slow with K24 generation turbos when time attack driving is on your focus.

Sorry I don't have a dyno chart comparison but you should get the point. And yes the suspension is all uniball, adjustable shocks and aggressive alignment. Tires used are Pirelli Trofeo R.
An aftermarket ECU that is capable of boost control & traction control would be something to look into. What tires are you running?
 
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