For you CGT guys, I humbly suggest...
For you CGT guys, I humbly suggest...
Forget the CGT -- Buy a 959.
1) More exclusive
2) More revolutionary
3) Racing heritage -- as in it did race, as opposed to "was going to race"
4) 911 legacy
5) half the price, unlikely to depreciate as much if at all
6) AWD -- and a kind never duplicated
7) Better looking (totally subjective)
8) Can be used in Modern USA on more than perfect roads
9) Etc... I'm sure there are many more reasons!
And with the money you save, wait a few years and then pick up a CGT with 4000 miles and you have both!
1) More exclusive
2) More revolutionary
3) Racing heritage -- as in it did race, as opposed to "was going to race"
4) 911 legacy
5) half the price, unlikely to depreciate as much if at all
6) AWD -- and a kind never duplicated
7) Better looking (totally subjective)
8) Can be used in Modern USA on more than perfect roads
9) Etc... I'm sure there are many more reasons!
And with the money you save, wait a few years and then pick up a CGT with 4000 miles and you have both!
From what I've read about the 959, if you care about
performance and handling, you can probably get and
modify a 996tt to beat the 959 in all objective performance
criteria for much less than the 959's cost.
As to exclusivity, or revolutionary (for it's time) sure, etc.
I only care about real performance and handling, and maybe cost.
As amazing as the 959 was when it was produced, time
eventually catches up. Of the two types of 959, I ead that the
non-sport version doesn't even perform as well as the basic
996tt. My 2 cents...
Joe
performance and handling, you can probably get and
modify a 996tt to beat the 959 in all objective performance
criteria for much less than the 959's cost.
As to exclusivity, or revolutionary (for it's time) sure, etc.
I only care about real performance and handling, and maybe cost.
As amazing as the 959 was when it was produced, time
eventually catches up. Of the two types of 959, I ead that the
non-sport version doesn't even perform as well as the basic
996tt. My 2 cents...
Joe
I meant this post to be more playful than some seem to take it, hence the wink...
However, having owned a GT2, and several 996TT/993TT...etc. I can comfortably say the 959 is my favorite.
I can say that my car handles better than the other cars. Be careful who you believe on what the car can do -- lots of people who haven't driven one, or haven't taken the time to get the car in good running order...
Also, handling is somewhat subjective, though there are some establish measurements...etc. like skidpad, where undoubtedly modern cars will always win.
I think it is safe to say that the CGT, by Joe's measure, is a waste of money, in that you can spend less than 440K and find cars that will outperform it...
I love the CGT, just merely pointing out that what is new today will someday be old, and then it will either be a rare classic, or something a little less. For me the 959 is a rare classic, and for what it costs, an interesing alternative to the CGT.
Most bang for the buck... I'd say a Ruf car.
However, having owned a GT2, and several 996TT/993TT...etc. I can comfortably say the 959 is my favorite.
I can say that my car handles better than the other cars. Be careful who you believe on what the car can do -- lots of people who haven't driven one, or haven't taken the time to get the car in good running order...
Also, handling is somewhat subjective, though there are some establish measurements...etc. like skidpad, where undoubtedly modern cars will always win.
I think it is safe to say that the CGT, by Joe's measure, is a waste of money, in that you can spend less than 440K and find cars that will outperform it...
I love the CGT, just merely pointing out that what is new today will someday be old, and then it will either be a rare classic, or something a little less. For me the 959 is a rare classic, and for what it costs, an interesing alternative to the CGT.
Most bang for the buck... I'd say a Ruf car.
Last but not least, the 959 is a de-tuned racing engine, titanium rods...etc. If you wanted to buy one (190K) and fix it up, I bet you could crush anything short of an Enzo or CGT (and maybe them too) for much less than the cost of either. THe engine will happily do more than 650HP all day long... Literally...
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CGT would be my choice with all of the advanced electronics it uses.
In addition, I couldn't imagine what a 959 would cost to repair if anything went wrong with the motor or even a fender bender. (a CGT can't be cheap to repair either, but that's what a warranty is for).
I just wish the CGT was closer to 200K!
In addition, I couldn't imagine what a 959 would cost to repair if anything went wrong with the motor or even a fender bender. (a CGT can't be cheap to repair either, but that's what a warranty is for).
I just wish the CGT was closer to 200K!
Best car made? Perhaps, I guess it depends on the situation. Best street legal track car?
Certainly not best rally car.
Give me a car that wins LeMans and Paris-Dakar

PS -- I love all Porsches, or almost all of them...
Certainly not best rally car.
Give me a car that wins LeMans and Paris-Dakar

PS -- I love all Porsches, or almost all of them...
I've heard and read that the 959s AWD system is superior to that of the 996turbo in inclement conditions such as snow and ice. I have a book I got as a gift a long time ago by the name of "Legendary Porsche" that has excerpts from people that worked at Porsche when the 959/Gruppe B was developed and there's an excerpt from Huschke Von Hanstein where he says they took the preproduction 959 out to an abandoned air strip in the middle of winter in Germany and got the car up to 320 km/h on more than one occassion on a completely frozen runway and the car performed flawlessly. Dean, I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on this...
FWIW -- the AWD in the 959 is superior to all other AWD in versatility and ability to handle less than ideal conditions. Unfortunately, it was simply too expensive to ever do again...
As for the rest of it -- I bet you can get a 02 Turbo pretty cheap and turn it into a monster for a ton less money than any 959 or CGT. I totally get that, and think it is great... I just was trying to point out, somewhat playfully, that CGT is a very expensive car of which there will be 1500 examples. I love the car, but expect its low and long overhang will limit its use somewhat. I hope to have one soon, but have my doubts.
And while I know it is a super-car, I think that the 959 is more so because of its versatility and the advances it made. Many more than the CGT... I think of the CGT more like the GT1... A super-track-car...
As for the rest of it -- I bet you can get a 02 Turbo pretty cheap and turn it into a monster for a ton less money than any 959 or CGT. I totally get that, and think it is great... I just was trying to point out, somewhat playfully, that CGT is a very expensive car of which there will be 1500 examples. I love the car, but expect its low and long overhang will limit its use somewhat. I hope to have one soon, but have my doubts.
And while I know it is a super-car, I think that the 959 is more so because of its versatility and the advances it made. Many more than the CGT... I think of the CGT more like the GT1... A super-track-car...
I think the CGT and GT1 are very different cars. I view the CGT as a very exotic street car like the Bugatti, F50 and now the Enzo. The GT1 was a race car from the begining to the end and not really designed for the street. I bet a GT1 will take a CGT on the track. I think the GT1 is truely in a class all by it's self. To me the '98 GT1 is the ultimate P-car ever.






