What cars can beat a 996 Twin Turbo with Stage IV?
#91
03-01-2004, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by Hamann7
If you can find a US-spec GT2 for $125K let me know where I can find them so I can buy it.
And where is this 7:43 time?
You are obviously extremely biased towards Lamborghini and won't face the facts so it's pointless to continue this discussion.
If you think the Murcielago is a better handling car than the GT2, I want to have some of that crack you're smoking.
Did you ever ask yourself, well geez... how would a GT2 or Turbo with 570bhp do against the Lambo?
If you can find a US-spec GT2 for $125K let me know where I can find them so I can buy it.
And where is this 7:43 time?
You are obviously extremely biased towards Lamborghini and won't face the facts so it's pointless to continue this discussion.
If you think the Murcielago is a better handling car than the GT2, I want to have some of that crack you're smoking.
Did you ever ask yourself, well geez... how would a GT2 or Turbo with 570bhp do against the Lambo?
As for a Gt2, look around, pretty easy to find.
A Gt2, with 570hp, would beat the Murci, obviously there is a bit of a weight difference.
Do i think that the Murci can post a better lap time than a Gt2 both in stock form? Yes i do. Do i think that during several laps the weight of the Murci would cause it to cook its brakes and the Porsche would win in the long run? Yes i do. Would i rather be in a Murci cruising at 200mph than a Gt2? yes i would. Would i buy the Porsche over the Murci as a track car? Yes, but as an exotic, id take the Murci any day.
Auto Und Motorsport recently tested the Murci. Im trying to get the magazine with the 7.43.
Also Top Gear magazines track record is held by a Murcielago, and the Gt3 got whooped by a Gallardo, with the Gallardo being on a wet track.
#92
03-01-2004, 12:43 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by allanlambo
[B]No, im not biased towards Lamborghini. You are biased towards Porsche.
As for a Gt2, look around, pretty easy to find.
A Gt2, with 570hp, would beat the Murci, obviously there is a bit of a weight difference.
Do i think that the Murci can post a better lap time than a Gt2 both in stock form? Yes i do. Do i think that during several laps the weight of the Murci would cause it to cook its brakes and the Porsche would win in the long run? Yes i do. Would i rather be in a Murci cruising at 200mph than a Gt2? yes i would. Would i buy the Porsche over the Murci as a track car? Yes, but as an exotic, id take the Murci any day.
Auto Und Motorsport recently tested the Murci. Im trying to get the magazine with the 7.43.
Also Top Gear magazines track record is held by a Murcielago, and the Gt3 got whooped by a Gallardo, with the Gallardo being on a wet track. The Murcielago not only beat the Pagani Zonda, also the Koenigsegg.
[B]No, im not biased towards Lamborghini. You are biased towards Porsche.
As for a Gt2, look around, pretty easy to find.
A Gt2, with 570hp, would beat the Murci, obviously there is a bit of a weight difference.
Do i think that the Murci can post a better lap time than a Gt2 both in stock form? Yes i do. Do i think that during several laps the weight of the Murci would cause it to cook its brakes and the Porsche would win in the long run? Yes i do. Would i rather be in a Murci cruising at 200mph than a Gt2? yes i would. Would i buy the Porsche over the Murci as a track car? Yes, but as an exotic, id take the Murci any day.
Auto Und Motorsport recently tested the Murci. Im trying to get the magazine with the 7.43.
Also Top Gear magazines track record is held by a Murcielago, and the Gt3 got whooped by a Gallardo, with the Gallardo being on a wet track. The Murcielago not only beat the Pagani Zonda, also the Koenigsegg.
#93
03-01-2004, 12:49 PM
Heres just a quick look at 2003 Gt2, 600miles. MSRP 189,000 buy it now for 155,000. Obviously you can buy it for less. Not bad 40,000 loss in a few months. So what do you think you can buy 02 Gt2's for that have been driven?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2462853742
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2462853742
#94
03-01-2004, 12:55 PM
I have looked around for a GT2. I recently bought one, remember? And so did my friend Watt on this board, and prices are well above that. But that's neither here nor there and it's not really that pertinent to the Lambo vs. Porsche discussion.
The GT2 is a superior performance car to the Murcielago, period. All the experts would agree on that one.
Using your argument, the Murcielago in fact has a superior power-to-weight ratio than a stock GT2. Approximately 6.7 lbs. per bhp for the Lambo and 6.9lbs. per bhp for the GT2. So why is the GT2 faster?
How many Murcis do you ever see on a track day? Not very many in California and that is pretty indicative of the typical Lamborghini target customer. You can't tell me that people buy Lamborghini primarily because of its superior performance.
A friend of a guy on this board is a very avid Lambo collector. He hated Porsches. Then he decided to buy a 996 Turbo after he kept getting his *** kicked on the racetrack.
Look at the ergonomics, design, and weight of the Lambo, it is definitely not meant for motorsport.
As for cruising above 200mph, I think my friend Ruf-Racer might disagree with you on that point. His 993 Ruf Turbo can hit 218mph and average about 190mph for 90 miles, proven with his Open Road Racing trophies. If Lambos are superior for high speed, why aren't there any Lamborghini winners or even entrants in ORR or Silver State Classic?
The GT2 is a superior performance car to the Murcielago, period. All the experts would agree on that one.
Using your argument, the Murcielago in fact has a superior power-to-weight ratio than a stock GT2. Approximately 6.7 lbs. per bhp for the Lambo and 6.9lbs. per bhp for the GT2. So why is the GT2 faster?
How many Murcis do you ever see on a track day? Not very many in California and that is pretty indicative of the typical Lamborghini target customer. You can't tell me that people buy Lamborghini primarily because of its superior performance.
A friend of a guy on this board is a very avid Lambo collector. He hated Porsches. Then he decided to buy a 996 Turbo after he kept getting his *** kicked on the racetrack.
Look at the ergonomics, design, and weight of the Lambo, it is definitely not meant for motorsport.
As for cruising above 200mph, I think my friend Ruf-Racer might disagree with you on that point. His 993 Ruf Turbo can hit 218mph and average about 190mph for 90 miles, proven with his Open Road Racing trophies. If Lambos are superior for high speed, why aren't there any Lamborghini winners or even entrants in ORR or Silver State Classic?
Last edited by Hamann7; 03-01-2004 at 01:09 PM.
#95
03-01-2004, 01:07 PM
My neighbor almost bought a Murci for $175K or less. That's about 40% loss from its $300K base MSRP.
Even assuming your price of $125K, from $190K MSRP, this is only 34% loss.
The Gallardo is going to kill the Murcielago resale market.
Even assuming your price of $125K, from $190K MSRP, this is only 34% loss.
The Gallardo is going to kill the Murcielago resale market.
#96
03-01-2004, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by Hamann7
My neighbor almost bought a Murci for $175K or less. That's about 40% loss from its $300K base MSRP.
Even assuming your price of $125K, from $190K MSRP, this is only 34% loss.
The Gallardo is going to kill the Murcielago resale market.
My neighbor almost bought a Murci for $175K or less. That's about 40% loss from its $300K base MSRP.
Even assuming your price of $125K, from $190K MSRP, this is only 34% loss.
The Gallardo is going to kill the Murcielago resale market.
#97
03-01-2004, 01:17 PM
Originally posted by allanlambo
Oh and btw, do you think that Walter or Horst have more seat time in Porsches or Lambos on track?
Oh and btw, do you think that Walter or Horst have more seat time in Porsches or Lambos on track?
When you finally do get out of the dinosaur age and actually have a murci, then we can all have this argument again. But till then, your ancient Horse and Bull are awaiting you.
#98
03-01-2004, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by Hamann7
I have looked around for a GT2. I recently bought one, remember? And so did my friend Watt on this board, and prices are well above that. But that's neither here nor there and it's not really that pertinent to the Lambo vs. Porsche discussion.
The GT2 is a superior performance car to the Murcielago, period. All the experts would agree on that one.
Using your argument, the Murcielago in fact has a superior power-to-weight ratio than a stock GT2. Approximately 6.7 lbs. per bhp for the Lambo and 6.9lbs. per bhp for the GT2. So why is the GT2 faster?
How many Murcis do you ever see on a track day? Not very many in California and that is pretty indicative of the typical Lamborghini target customer. You can't tell me that people buy Lamborghini primarily because of its superior performance.
A friend of a guy on this board is a very avid Lambo collector. He hated Porsches. Then he decided to buy a 996 Turbo after he kept getting his *** kicked on the racetrack.
Look at the ergonomics, design, and weight of the Lambo, it is definitely not meant for motorsport.
As for cruising above 200mph, I think my friend Ruf-Racer might disagree with you on that point. His 993 Ruf Turbo can hit 218mph and average about 190mph for 90 miles, proven with his Open Road Racing trophies. If Lambos are superior for high speed, why aren't there any Lamborghini winners or even entrants in ORR or Silver State Classic?
I have looked around for a GT2. I recently bought one, remember? And so did my friend Watt on this board, and prices are well above that. But that's neither here nor there and it's not really that pertinent to the Lambo vs. Porsche discussion.
The GT2 is a superior performance car to the Murcielago, period. All the experts would agree on that one.
Using your argument, the Murcielago in fact has a superior power-to-weight ratio than a stock GT2. Approximately 6.7 lbs. per bhp for the Lambo and 6.9lbs. per bhp for the GT2. So why is the GT2 faster?
How many Murcis do you ever see on a track day? Not very many in California and that is pretty indicative of the typical Lamborghini target customer. You can't tell me that people buy Lamborghini primarily because of its superior performance.
A friend of a guy on this board is a very avid Lambo collector. He hated Porsches. Then he decided to buy a 996 Turbo after he kept getting his *** kicked on the racetrack.
Look at the ergonomics, design, and weight of the Lambo, it is definitely not meant for motorsport.
As for cruising above 200mph, I think my friend Ruf-Racer might disagree with you on that point. His 993 Ruf Turbo can hit 218mph and average about 190mph for 90 miles, proven with his Open Road Racing trophies. If Lambos are superior for high speed, why aren't there any Lamborghini winners or even entrants in ORR or Silver State Classic?
Are you talking about the guy with a countach who bought a 996TT? I would hope that a 2001 TT could beat a car that was designed in the early 1970's on a track.
As for your high speed runs, ive been in both at very high speed and the Lambo is much more stable.
As for speed for long periods, Lambo World Record:
http://www.lamborghiniregistry.com/News/Record.html
#99
03-01-2004, 01:27 PM
Originally posted by AeroTT
Good question Ellen. Do you have more seat time in 996TT's or Pre-historic Diablos? Your arguments on this board is against those who have tracked and know their 996tt's in and out. Your arguments of the murci vs. the 996tt is valid because...??? Oh wait, you dont even have one.
When you finally do get out of the dinosaur age and actually have a murci, then we can all have this argument again. But till then, your ancient Horse and Bull are awaiting you.
Good question Ellen. Do you have more seat time in 996TT's or Pre-historic Diablos? Your arguments on this board is against those who have tracked and know their 996tt's in and out. Your arguments of the murci vs. the 996tt is valid because...??? Oh wait, you dont even have one.
When you finally do get out of the dinosaur age and actually have a murci, then we can all have this argument again. But till then, your ancient Horse and Bull are awaiting you.
Well, with Maui being so limited in its use for cars like these, i cant substantiate adding a Murci. I could trade the Sv in, but i dont want to.
As of now, im just trying to figure out how in the world to add a Porsche 996TT to the collection. Its tough being poor. Hmm i could trade my 355 spider and get some money back.... or i could add a little to the Lotus and buy one.... nah.
#100
03-01-2004, 01:29 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: West Toluca Lake, CA
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Lamborghinis are fine exotic,high speed sportscars. They also look the part of ALMS racecars. Don't forget though that they appeal to a completely different crowd than those considered as as "drivers" or "enthusiasts." Afterall, I understand that the only RECENT history of racing activity with Lamborghini was through the late 90's in World Superboat Championships out of all things. Likewise, Gallardos, Murcielagos are production-based vehicles with supercar performance that's sole purpose in creation was to NOT race. I don't believe that Lamborghini sponsors any racing programs and supplies vehicles to privateers/contingencies for the purpose of R&D/evolution in racing? Finally, the market/demographics of actual Lambo owners clearly exemplifies this fact.
Last edited by RU_MATRX; 03-01-2004 at 01:32 PM.
#103
03-01-2004, 02:06 PM
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Where is the best source for info on FVD vs. Evo kits? Prices/Specs/Installation reqs. etc.
#104
03-01-2004, 02:12 PM
A guy in australia races a diablo in the World cup wih great success.
http://www.motorsm.com/Oz_Sandown500.asp
http://www.motorsm.com/Oz_Sandown500.asp
#105
03-01-2004, 02:53 PM
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Location: West Toluca Lake, CA
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Australian Nations Cup seems like a fun series to watch with all of the production based manufacturer's represented. Does Lamborghini actually fund or supply these vehicles or are they just private teams that fund themselves?