I am coming too. I had allready asked to find a way to get my car there in a temp status. Hopefully I'll finish the Gumball in one piece and make it there later.

 

What would be fair if we met half way. I have never been to CA, nor do I really plan on it. I have only had my car since August. If you are referring to the black turbo, I sold it...not to chicken out from CA, but because I got a rediculous offer I could not refuse. WHat is your excuse about coming this way? I am not sure why "several" people would PM you stating I would use coming to CA as an excuse? That is funny that they would say that. I am the one who is challenging for 3 reasons: To see both cars capabilities, to have fun doing it, and perhaps have an event via magazine coverage, thats it. If you feel more secure using the NOS (The only thing I stated wasn't fair) - Go right ahead and use it. I just don't think that would be a fair comoparison. I guess you are for athletes using steroids during track events too?

Just trying have some fun. You say you question what is being presented, but at least its being presented.

I called the Porsche Exchange, and they stated the numbers are DIN, not SAE - and to figure out SAE, figure 2 percent less of what was posted. I think Stephen assumed it, I just noticed the "DIN" myself. Sorry, but I didn't post the charts to defraud anyone. It is european DIN numbers being reflected, not SAE.

The challenge is in CHICAGO. Accept or Decline(Chicken out...again ) Personally, I think KA would destroy me, and we can all have some fun watching it.

 

Yes Michael. Since the program was released there have been several changes. I too run the GT kit and make 609HP. The kit continues to improve. Both Todd and I have probably spent more hours with the GT kit than any of the other kits. There were several changes to the program in regards to timing and load. The low midrange was brought up in Ryan's car as well as mine and the effect was the car stood up on end. Once again, it wasn't HP we continue to strive for, but making it the most drivable kit out there.

Ryan,
Have the exchange load the files to disc and send them out. The files are saved uncorrected and are raw data. They can be corrected to what ever factor you want after that. The corrections can be done by the exchange through the computer or calculated on your end. The point is if anyone is in doubt have them get the exchange to do a disc. Uncorrected data can be gotten. My dyno has done this for me when people have questioned, we simply email it out and let them apply what ever factors they want.

Chad,
My apologies about the posted DIN numbers. We had many printed sheets, some in SAE and some in DIN. All the ones from the Mustang were uncorrected.

 

Ryan,

You are the one who wants to run Killer Angel. You have wanted to run her for a long time. When you said about a year ago that you were going to bring your car to California and run her, what did you mean by that? I have currently run against cars in my own backyard making far in excess of 650 rwhp. I don't see the point in taking her back east at this time for a fun run. If you want to run, bring her over and I will do it. Otherwise, I am not interested at this time. It is not the exposure I am after.

You say that you have not seen a posted dyno sheet but in fact up until November 2003, you saw alot more. I posted in ten rpm increaments SAE rwhp, torque and afr's. Point to anyplace you can obtain this information on a graph with accuracy? Yes, anyone can report wrong numbers, just as you can photoshop a graph. I am not saying you have done this. I am pointing out the falacy of your arguement.

If anyone simply gave me an answer like you did in your last paragraph, I would not be so doubtful. According to many others, Todd has done them good and they are happy. I have had other experiences. If you want I can explain them and then you may have a better insight on why I feel the way I do.

 

Why dont you guys meet in the middle say Las Vegas, then you cannot say someone is chickening out.

 

I see your point, and you really don't have anything to prove. Just that on several posts, you make "Killer Angel" to be the one to "watch out for" or the one to beat, when from my perspective... Tyson's car, Sharkeys, and Cargraphics did faster documented 1/4 mile runs than the 11.4 Killer Angel. Hell, I did 11.33 post roock at englishtown.

And Chad, Just for the record, I consider myself somewhat good in photoshop, but I would never falsify a dyno sheet and make false claims. When we printed the sheets, Stephen printed two copies as well.

 

I must say that Todd's passion for POWER, his love for the car, his prices, his constant desire to improve on what he's already achieved and then pass that on to his current customer base, along with his customer service makes him the OBVIOUS choice for someone looking for a tuner!.....He may or may not have the "fastest" or "best" but as far as consistent, reliable, bolt on, and his ability to work through a problem make him the man!

I rarely hear a bad word said about Todd or Evo however i consisently hear praise and and i know first hand how much enjoyment i get from my car and what LITTLE money compared to many others out there i have had to put into my car, comparatively speaking, to get the results im getting!!

I can testify FIRST handedly that ive dealt with only a few "tuners" out there and they were ROOCK HORRIBLE, ScARGO with those Crazy
F---ed up headers they sold me that were supposed to be the **** LOL

and then after hundereds of dollars putting on and taking off to see a month later them not selling those but shorter ones i mean come on!!!

Some how todd knows what the car needs and when its put OUT there to the PUBLIC it ROCKS!!!

Way to go Todd and i am definately looking forward to any enhancements to the stage 4GT!!!

 

Hi, I am new here; a lurker no longer.

Maybe we should get Don King to promote the Evo vs. KA fight?

 

RacerX,

I had the same thing happen with an EVO exhaust I purchased in October 2001. It plain didn't handle 550 hp. I ate that one. Those long Scargo headers are another example of the same thing. It was my understanding that anyone who went back to Rob had these replaced with the short ones. I know of three instances of this. I believe Ryan had something along these lines. Todd never made anything right with his exhaust with me and I called them about it. Maybe he has changed is ways.

You really don't want me to start going over this on the forums. I could start by scanning a magazine article and posting it for discussion.

 

Ryan,

Thankyou. In my mind, I don't have anything to prove and I have always resisted any attempt to be goaded into a contest. I stopped posting times for track and strip and refused to participate in the shootout. I wouldn't assume KA has not been to the strip or the track since then. There are a few in my neighborhood who have experienced her capabilities, they don't have times, but they all agree she is very fast. You state "I make Killer Angel the one to beat" but in reality with a 11.3 or 11.4 quarter mile why would Killer Angel be the one to beat? I have always said Tyson's car had the best posted quarter mile times to date for a turbo/GT2. I have never posted anything better than the above times. Who is really making KA the one to beat? I believe the shankenfelder needs to beat a 10.7 and post it if you want something to beat at this time. As for Killer Angel, she is content for the moment to be watching from the sidelines.

I'm going to leave it at this, you don't want to come to California and I don't want to go to Chicago. That's cool. I have no more questons.

 

One thing I dont get is that with all the money/time you spent in your car from what I read, why it didnt perform better in the Magazine shootout? Im not bashing at all, just curious, from the numbers Ive heard you spent on your brakes and suspension, I would have figured you dominated in those categories, but it was 4th in road course and 2nd in brakes? I dont think it actually won any category, again, Im not trying to provoke negative criticism, Im just curious because if I spent the amount of money you did and got those results I would have been absolutely furious with SCarGo. Doesnt make sense to me why someone would spend 4-5x as much then a place like EVO/Imagine/Protomotive to get sub performance results.

 

KA wasn't in the shootout, what are you talking about

 

You guys fight like little girls!

That GIAC/Evo GT2 is DAMN powerful! Praise where it is deserved.

As far as this car versus that one-
No-one will know untill they meet. And than if they do everyone will ***** about "Secret Sauce, Too much boost, N02, super cooled this and that......"

Everyone here has respect for KA. I have not even seen it, but I met some of the ScarGo guys and they seem to offer a solid product. And seem like a group of good guys.

For this argument the only way to really see is to strap both car onto the same dyno.

AFAIK that is the only way to really claim the bragging rights. Until than I will just be satisfied that they are both very, very fast cars, owned by Type A competitive people.

I hope this comes across properly! This forum seems to have a lot of good info and a positive vibe. Except for all this bull.

Jeff

 

I thought the SCarGo car in the shootout was CJV, if not, then nevermind my comments.

 

I can verify what Stephen is saying. The first day using the Mustang Dyno, the wonderful people at fall-line weren't exactly sure how to use the dyno or extract the correct numbers. They had just gotten the dyno and I am not sure that the proper options were even checked to get the proper numbers. Great knowledgable guys, just a little inexperienced with the dyno as they had just gotten in 1 week prior. They simply ran the dyno the same everytime so that Todd and Stephen could get like numbers, compare to the baseline numbers and correct the curve. The entire time, they both kept saying the numbers are irrelevant anyway, just want to correct the curve. Honestly, Todd and Stephen didn't care one bit about the peak numbers, what they did care about was smoothing the curve and having a nice power curve. They accomplished their task and that is really what counts.

Lou