Any info on this 977.2tt exhaust?
Sorry I was unaware of the switch for the 997TT.2 , They did make them for the previous generation turbo and have not heard anything from speedART about the switch yet. I don't think the switch was quality control related though. M&M makes a quality exhaust system and has been for a long time.
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Bosco42,
Ask anyone about our service, we live by our word.
Thanks,
Rhonda
Ask anyone about our service, we live by our word.
Thanks,
Rhonda
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Its nice to know someones on the same page. Kudos to you for being straight up honest 
.
Ok...well, just make sure that those "good times" actually do "keep on rollin".... because "life is too short". Some may not know that just yet but we all find that one out soon enough 
.
.M&M is a supplier to Porsche Motor sports so we are not talking about some rag, tag outfit, they and myself are extremely aware of what the OEM systems sound like and where the resonance / drone resides in the rpm range. When you say Porsche with all of their expertise and resources has been unable to take the slight resonance/drone out, keep in mind that they have to be within the 75 dB (limit by law) and have to be profitable.
Hmm... So M & M dont have to be profitable? So they are a charity organisation?
With the incredible sound design studio that Boysen has, I would think that they have been able to take out the resonance/drone but at what dB and at what price?
You have a few unknowns there.
Excuse my ignorance here Rhonda but im assuming Boysen is M&M?
Meeting the 75 dB mark, making power, having an acceptable sound and being profitable is an extremely difficult combination.
We are talking about Porsche here Rhonda. An extremely **** company prepared to go to all lengths, odds and expense to ensure buyer satisfaction globally, within the realms of their emission and noise regulation requirements of the 75 db limit. So if they (P) havent managed to eliminate the drone entirely having the luxury of having being able to manufacture to a quieter exhaust (standard) system then i guess you are having us believe they could have eliminated the drone far easier if they were able to make it somewhat "noisier"? C'mon!! It would be the other way round. The noisier the exhaust the harder it would be to deal with removing the drone.
The current OEM system falls within Porsche tolerance and is made for worldwide distribution.
Got it.
I have been working here for the past 6 years now and have a lot of experience with stock turbo exhaust systems.
Selling aftermarket systems as a replacement to an oem system would be relatively easy given the overly refined/quiet lame sounding oem system of the 997tt .1. It'd be a bit like taking candy off babies. Very little sales expertise required i'd say. Owners are googling you tube clips in vain for sound auditions....searchin for the solution...cheque book is already out....
I don’t own a 997TT but I do own a 987 Boxster S that is also guilty of the same slight resonance/drone at similar rpms.
I've driven a number of boxters for days on end and didn't experience drone or resonance in the same vein as the 997tt.1. The main difference being with the Boxter and, Boxter S is that they are both naturally aspirated with an infinately more satisfying note than any 997tt.1 could ever produce stock therefore any misgivings the Boxter S may or may not have are very easily overlooked. The 997.1 tt on the other hand sounds lousy all the time and, with a mild drone, so its easier to end up focussing on the obvious faults as unlike the boxter there is no other good sounds to detract you from it..
I have no idea what owning a 997TT has to do with anything.
I think you need to take a closer look at the context in which i made that comment. There was never to be any offense intended toward you. Just pointing out that if you owned one as a daily driver you would know precisely what i mean. A non owner can have the odd drive and be in awe of the acceleration and other aspects of the car and wont get a true handle on the obvious problem as an owner will.
The drone that I hear when testing a 997TT with an OEM muffler would just be apparent on a daily basis if I owned one.
Yes. Thats what i am saying. Its hard not to notice as there are no other nice sounding "distractions".
If you experience it once or a thousand times does anything change?
No,.. other than the constant thought that you need to fix that asap....along with adding some kind of P sound that belongs with the car....and, is not there at all....when it should be.
When I say money back guaranteed, if you are not happy we will pay for shipping both ways, pay for the install, everything. No questions asked!
Well i must say on that note Rhonda you have won me. With nothing to lose other than the agro of having to go through the motions of having it removed and sent back etc in the event things were found not to be of ones liking then i must say you have a fantastic approach to business and i applaud you for that.
Hats off to you and FVD for that approach .
Here is a little background to the problem that AlexM had with our system. Until his system we had sold many systems to a lot of 6 speeders, none of which complained of drone. Of that I can assure you.
Can i just politely say: The jury is out on that one going by what i've heard.
Earlier this year Bagger (you may know him) had an issue, his system generated a tractor like or what he dubbed “clown fart” on deceleration. The M&M 997 TT systems control drone with a balance tube. The balance tube is made by hand and must be precision made, if it is a few mm off it can generate that tractor like sound on deceleration.
OK.
M&M are perfectionists and decided to make a new design that would lessen the risk of creating this issue in production. They sent us 2 new systems, which were to be tested here in house. We tested one of the newly designed systems and it sounded even more aggressive but had drone.
Yep. Not surprised to hear that.
Now comes the problem, the second muffler was accidentally put into stock! So AlexM received the 2nd test muffler.
An unfortunate accident?? That muffler should have been in the bin. Whats cooking with that?
That is why there is such a large disparity between what many members are saying and what unfortunately happened with AlexM’s system.
I've heard many members comment how certain sytems drone, and then many other members say these same systems dont. Its a very hard call what to believe i'm afraid. One must go back to the stock systems mild drone and base any future expectations from that.
If AlexM will chime in here he will tell you that he needed the system very quickly, (like most 997tt.1 owners...myself inc) unfortunately we only had a 100 cell system in stock and the can is different. So I put together a package with the used 200 cell cats that we tested and what I thought was a new sound version muffler. Much to my dismay it was not, we were truly baffled to hear that it was droning. We were thinking it was something to do with the tips as we had never heard someone complain of drone. We eventually discovered that it was the 2nd test system!! We offered AlexM a new one but he declined. So unfortunately I could not rectify the situation.
Ok then.
With that said, I admire an exhaust company that is willing to go back to the drawing board to make customers happy. There are very few in the industry that go to such lengths.
Totally agree on that and hats off to those that do the right thing.
Working with M&M has been amazing, they designs are never stagnant, if they learn something on the track that benefits street systems they will put it into production.
Ok.
AlexM would never be struck off my Christmas list, nor would you for that matter.
Then maybe i'd better give you my address...you may have it if you check back in your emails
. A chrissy card would be nice.
I don’t have an ego speed21,
C'mon. A women without an ego?? Now you're stretchin it!!
so the above statement doesn’t matter to me,
When someone says it doesn't matter....it matters. But thats fine. You're obviously a great gal Rhonda and I would love to do biz one day given your ethics and enthusiasm.....that is if i do don't punish me too hard for this. FVD better be payin you plenty.You're an asset.
as your signature says “life’s too short….so let the good times roll!!”
Hmm... So M & M dont have to be profitable? So they are a charity organisation?
With the incredible sound design studio that Boysen has, I would think that they have been able to take out the resonance/drone but at what dB and at what price?
You have a few unknowns there.
Excuse my ignorance here Rhonda but im assuming Boysen is M&M?
Meeting the 75 dB mark, making power, having an acceptable sound and being profitable is an extremely difficult combination.
We are talking about Porsche here Rhonda. An extremely **** company prepared to go to all lengths, odds and expense to ensure buyer satisfaction globally, within the realms of their emission and noise regulation requirements of the 75 db limit. So if they (P) havent managed to eliminate the drone entirely having the luxury of having being able to manufacture to a quieter exhaust (standard) system then i guess you are having us believe they could have eliminated the drone far easier if they were able to make it somewhat "noisier"? C'mon!! It would be the other way round. The noisier the exhaust the harder it would be to deal with removing the drone.
The current OEM system falls within Porsche tolerance and is made for worldwide distribution.
Got it.
I have been working here for the past 6 years now and have a lot of experience with stock turbo exhaust systems.
Selling aftermarket systems as a replacement to an oem system would be relatively easy given the overly refined/quiet lame sounding oem system of the 997tt .1. It'd be a bit like taking candy off babies. Very little sales expertise required i'd say. Owners are googling you tube clips in vain for sound auditions....searchin for the solution...cheque book is already out....
I don’t own a 997TT but I do own a 987 Boxster S that is also guilty of the same slight resonance/drone at similar rpms.
I've driven a number of boxters for days on end and didn't experience drone or resonance in the same vein as the 997tt.1. The main difference being with the Boxter and, Boxter S is that they are both naturally aspirated with an infinately more satisfying note than any 997tt.1 could ever produce stock therefore any misgivings the Boxter S may or may not have are very easily overlooked. The 997.1 tt on the other hand sounds lousy all the time and, with a mild drone, so its easier to end up focussing on the obvious faults as unlike the boxter there is no other good sounds to detract you from it..
I have no idea what owning a 997TT has to do with anything.
I think you need to take a closer look at the context in which i made that comment. There was never to be any offense intended toward you. Just pointing out that if you owned one as a daily driver you would know precisely what i mean. A non owner can have the odd drive and be in awe of the acceleration and other aspects of the car and wont get a true handle on the obvious problem as an owner will.
The drone that I hear when testing a 997TT with an OEM muffler would just be apparent on a daily basis if I owned one.
Yes. Thats what i am saying. Its hard not to notice as there are no other nice sounding "distractions".
If you experience it once or a thousand times does anything change?
No,.. other than the constant thought that you need to fix that asap....along with adding some kind of P sound that belongs with the car....and, is not there at all....when it should be.
When I say money back guaranteed, if you are not happy we will pay for shipping both ways, pay for the install, everything. No questions asked!
Well i must say on that note Rhonda you have won me. With nothing to lose other than the agro of having to go through the motions of having it removed and sent back etc in the event things were found not to be of ones liking then i must say you have a fantastic approach to business and i applaud you for that.
Hats off to you and FVD for that approach .Here is a little background to the problem that AlexM had with our system. Until his system we had sold many systems to a lot of 6 speeders, none of which complained of drone. Of that I can assure you.
Can i just politely say: The jury is out on that one going by what i've heard.
Earlier this year Bagger (you may know him) had an issue, his system generated a tractor like or what he dubbed “clown fart” on deceleration. The M&M 997 TT systems control drone with a balance tube. The balance tube is made by hand and must be precision made, if it is a few mm off it can generate that tractor like sound on deceleration.
OK.
M&M are perfectionists and decided to make a new design that would lessen the risk of creating this issue in production. They sent us 2 new systems, which were to be tested here in house. We tested one of the newly designed systems and it sounded even more aggressive but had drone.
Yep. Not surprised to hear that.
Now comes the problem, the second muffler was accidentally put into stock! So AlexM received the 2nd test muffler.
An unfortunate accident?? That muffler should have been in the bin. Whats cooking with that?
That is why there is such a large disparity between what many members are saying and what unfortunately happened with AlexM’s system.
I've heard many members comment how certain sytems drone, and then many other members say these same systems dont. Its a very hard call what to believe i'm afraid. One must go back to the stock systems mild drone and base any future expectations from that.
If AlexM will chime in here he will tell you that he needed the system very quickly, (like most 997tt.1 owners...myself inc) unfortunately we only had a 100 cell system in stock and the can is different. So I put together a package with the used 200 cell cats that we tested and what I thought was a new sound version muffler. Much to my dismay it was not, we were truly baffled to hear that it was droning. We were thinking it was something to do with the tips as we had never heard someone complain of drone. We eventually discovered that it was the 2nd test system!! We offered AlexM a new one but he declined. So unfortunately I could not rectify the situation.
Ok then.
With that said, I admire an exhaust company that is willing to go back to the drawing board to make customers happy. There are very few in the industry that go to such lengths.
Totally agree on that and hats off to those that do the right thing.
Working with M&M has been amazing, they designs are never stagnant, if they learn something on the track that benefits street systems they will put it into production.
Ok.
AlexM would never be struck off my Christmas list, nor would you for that matter.
Then maybe i'd better give you my address...you may have it if you check back in your emails
. A chrissy card would be nice.I don’t have an ego speed21,
C'mon. A women without an ego?? Now you're stretchin it!!
so the above statement doesn’t matter to me,
When someone says it doesn't matter....it matters. But thats fine. You're obviously a great gal Rhonda and I would love to do biz one day given your ethics and enthusiasm.....that is if i do don't punish me too hard for this. FVD better be payin you plenty.You're an asset
.as your signature says “life’s too short….so let the good times roll!!”
.
Last edited by speed21; Aug 21, 2010 at 06:59 AM.
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Funny you say that TT.
I also changed out my tubi street to EP1 due to resonance/drone/noise issues. The EP1 is actually slightly louder on the outside than the tubi street yet is not nearly annoying as tubi was. Agree EP1 still has a slight resonance/ drone but it is "tolerable" as you appear to have also found. I am a harsh sound critic....probably because i am not deaf yet .
EP1 being a far more sophisticated (better) sounding exhaust in every conceivable way plus that distinct tangible improvement felt on the butt dyno....a bonus if you will. Cant say i got that with tubi....which i still have yet to shift
.
Like yourself I'm totally done with loud exhausts, particular ones with intolerable levels of drone/resonance which accounts for basically 99% of them (unfortunately going by the user feedback i've since received from those that have buckled under the strain of the dreaded "millstone" and also surrendered and changed out to EP1). It seems im not alone.
Just be thankfull EP provided a solution. Imagine having to put the stock system back on . Drone and with a lousy wooshy note.
I also changed out my tubi street to EP1 due to resonance/drone/noise issues. The EP1 is actually slightly louder on the outside than the tubi street yet is not nearly annoying as tubi was. Agree EP1 still has a slight resonance/ drone but it is "tolerable" as you appear to have also found
. I am a harsh sound critic....probably because i am not deaf yet .EP1 being a far more sophisticated (better) sounding exhaust in every conceivable way plus that distinct tangible improvement felt on the butt dyno....a bonus if you will. Cant say i got that with tubi....which i still have yet to shift
. Like yourself I'm totally done with loud exhausts, particular ones with intolerable levels of drone/resonance which accounts for basically 99% of them (unfortunately going by the user feedback i've since received from those that have buckled under the strain of the dreaded "millstone" and also surrendered and changed out to EP1).
It seems im not alone.Just be thankfull EP provided a solution
. Imagine having to put the stock system back on . Drone and with a lousy wooshy note.Re the FVD systems, I have tried each and every one of their systems, they all have minimal resonance, as does the stock, but really no drone (as I define it) at all. Drone is when your wife screams at you to shift at ~ 3000rpm.
Anytime I had a problem with FVD, they happily sent a new item, etc. Their customer service is the best.
My only criticism of the EP1 is that it could actually be a tad louder...but be careful what you wish for...
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Adrian,
With all do respect, your location says Stuttgart so I am assuming that you are German. If that is the case, I respect the fact that you are posting in English. Perhaps you are a bit unfamiliar with posting on 6speed. If you would be so kind, refer to post #1. Dksu’s post simply started as “Any info on this 997.2TT exhaust?” When you watch the video it clearly states M&M exhaust from Germany. I will give you a little background on that video. It was contributed by a Porsche Dealer that carries FVD products. The dealer made that video for his customers who are interested in a 997.2TT M&M exhaust that is sold by us. So by simply answering dksu’s initial question correctly we could have forgone this entire “our supplier / your supplier” convoluted post. I am not sure why you feel the need to add to this post in the manner that you have but, since you have let me explain why this is so important to me.
On post # 11, Matthew at GMP stated “M&M also makes the speedART exhausts as well, most of the sound characteristics come from the baffles inside the muffler which can be changed upon request of the tuner.” Again, the initial post was a reference to 997.2TT exhaust, the statement above is misleading. Is dksu now to believe that he can purchase your 997.2TT exhaust and receive an M&M product?
On post # 14, I (Rhonda) clearly stated that “M&M is NOT SpeedArts exhaust supplier for the above mentioned 997.2TT muffler.” That statement is correct, is it not? The reason that I posted my comment on # 14 is simple. If you say that a certain supplier makes an exhaust and that is not the case that is called misrepresentation. Since you brought this issue back up, here is my problem with this. Members on this forum are passionate about how they want their 997.2 turbos to sound, they invest large amounts of their time in picking out what suits their taste. Some have even traveled hundreds of miles listen to a certain exhaust, that’s how important they are to them. They pay for their systems with hard earned cash and deserve exactly what they want. Would it be fair for that member to purchase a system for thousands of dollars and not get exactly what they were expecting? The answer is no and I will simply NOT stand for that. We have a term for that here in the U.S., it’s called false advertising. As a German it may be interesting for you to ask the federal trade commission what the definition is and how it pertains this post.
Maybe this example will help, lets say dksu talked to members on 6 speed, listened to as many videos as he could, heard a few systems locally and decided on and FVD / M&M product. He heard through GMP that M&M also produces the exhausts for his car and purchased it. Low and behold, he receives it in Hawaii and finds that it doesn’t have an M&M logo on it and it is not the sound he was looking for on his 997.2TT!! I am sorry Adrian but that is a sickening thought to me, I have integrity and I would have an extremely hard time accepting that.
That leads me to your post, which is titled “FVD / M & M / speedART 997 Turbo 2.Generation sport exhaust “. Why even put the three together? Why not just state facts about your companies exhaust to clarify the issue? You are now making the issue even more convoluted.
You say “Because of the trouble with FVD (here especially Rhonda and M&M)”. What trouble are you talking about here? Matthew and I have never had any trouble to my knowledge; to me we have been very respectful to one another. In fact, he apologized for his oversight in regards to this post, and I haven’t thought anything of it.
You go on to say, “have decided to cooperate in case of the 997 Turbo 2.Generation sport exhaust with an OE Porsche exhaust manufacturer which can not be announced right now.” Ok you can’t announce it right now, can you tell me this? Will your new OE Porsche exhaust supplier manufacture your valved and non valved exhaust’s in Germany?
You also state “We will not sell exhausts with any uncomfortable drone effect anymore.” Since a forum member pointed out your current supplier in post # 16, is that who you are referring to?
How about this comment? “The ECU of the new DFI engines from Porsche are controling the exhaust gas back pressure and "here it comes" the ECU adapts the values in the ECU back to a standard exhaust gas back pressure. That means: "No power increase without ECU update!" It is strange that we have shown the first exhaust of this type at the Essen Motorshow 2009. Since almost one year we have those informations about the power increase problem and make it public in every eMail, phone call or letter. Bad reputation to the Porsche tuning industry and this is the proof of somebodys inadequacy.”
Instead of emails, phone calls and letters, which are useless to your U.S. customers, perhaps you should add it on a website where it is more readily available.
Here is a link to GMP Performance’s website for 997.2 TT exhaust…
Here is what that link states...
997.2 Turbo Sport Muffler System
Porsche's 997.2 Turbo is already a phenomenal machine by any measure, but such precedents have never kept speedART from finding ways to improve upon Stuttgart's finest! Designed specifcially for the all-new 3.8L Turbo DFI engine, our Sport Muffler System liberates 30 additional horsepower and 30 lb-ft of torque, while producing a sound that could only come from a Porsche! In addition to the muffler, the kit also includes 200 cell high-flow catalytic converters, and all necessary hardware for installation. It's designed to work with either the factory tips, or speedART's GT2-Style single-round 100mm tips (see Related Items at bottom).
Also the related items at the bottom are tips, not software…
Now lets take a peak at the FVD website and “here it comes”….
FACTS:
- + 25 crank hp & + 19 crank torque (with FVD Software) **
- 200 Cell high flow, tri metal german HJS sport catalysts
- 2 3/4" tubing (70mm) straight through design for max. power
- Weighs 51 lbs. (23,0 Kg)
- T 316 stainless steel for improved durability over T 304
- 98dB at idle and partial rpms, 100 dB at wide open throttle
- Cone style catalytic connection design to prevent exhaust leaks
- Includes quick release clamps
- Made in Germany
- Modular design for 100 cell, 200 cell or bypass use
- Intoxicating growl at idle, partial throttle and wide open throttle
- No DME programming necessary.
Please Note:
Exhaust tips are not included! Stock tips will fit.
The tips pictured above can be purchased separately. They are "quad" 3.5" (90/100mm) tips and are made for this muffler. Kindly order BES 997 260 41S separately.
**Please Note:The 997.2 TT has a pressure sensor that measures backpressure. A lack of backpressure with any exhaust system and will be picked up by the sensor and adjust or reduce the power accordingly. With out a software file the exhaust system is just for sound only. Once a program is added you will achieve 580 + Hp
@Adrian speedArt: This is a free country my friend. I will talk about M&M being our supplier all day long, that’s my job. Exclusivity? In regards to a 997.2TT exhaust post, I think you have just made it abundantly clear that you are no longer selling M&M. Homework done!
Best regards Rhonda
With all do respect, your location says Stuttgart so I am assuming that you are German. If that is the case, I respect the fact that you are posting in English. Perhaps you are a bit unfamiliar with posting on 6speed. If you would be so kind, refer to post #1. Dksu’s post simply started as “Any info on this 997.2TT exhaust?” When you watch the video it clearly states M&M exhaust from Germany. I will give you a little background on that video. It was contributed by a Porsche Dealer that carries FVD products. The dealer made that video for his customers who are interested in a 997.2TT M&M exhaust that is sold by us. So by simply answering dksu’s initial question correctly we could have forgone this entire “our supplier / your supplier” convoluted post. I am not sure why you feel the need to add to this post in the manner that you have but, since you have let me explain why this is so important to me.
On post # 11, Matthew at GMP stated “M&M also makes the speedART exhausts as well, most of the sound characteristics come from the baffles inside the muffler which can be changed upon request of the tuner.” Again, the initial post was a reference to 997.2TT exhaust, the statement above is misleading. Is dksu now to believe that he can purchase your 997.2TT exhaust and receive an M&M product?
On post # 14, I (Rhonda) clearly stated that “M&M is NOT SpeedArts exhaust supplier for the above mentioned 997.2TT muffler.” That statement is correct, is it not? The reason that I posted my comment on # 14 is simple. If you say that a certain supplier makes an exhaust and that is not the case that is called misrepresentation. Since you brought this issue back up, here is my problem with this. Members on this forum are passionate about how they want their 997.2 turbos to sound, they invest large amounts of their time in picking out what suits their taste. Some have even traveled hundreds of miles listen to a certain exhaust, that’s how important they are to them. They pay for their systems with hard earned cash and deserve exactly what they want. Would it be fair for that member to purchase a system for thousands of dollars and not get exactly what they were expecting? The answer is no and I will simply NOT stand for that. We have a term for that here in the U.S., it’s called false advertising. As a German it may be interesting for you to ask the federal trade commission what the definition is and how it pertains this post.
Maybe this example will help, lets say dksu talked to members on 6 speed, listened to as many videos as he could, heard a few systems locally and decided on and FVD / M&M product. He heard through GMP that M&M also produces the exhausts for his car and purchased it. Low and behold, he receives it in Hawaii and finds that it doesn’t have an M&M logo on it and it is not the sound he was looking for on his 997.2TT!! I am sorry Adrian but that is a sickening thought to me, I have integrity and I would have an extremely hard time accepting that.
That leads me to your post, which is titled “FVD / M & M / speedART 997 Turbo 2.Generation sport exhaust “. Why even put the three together? Why not just state facts about your companies exhaust to clarify the issue? You are now making the issue even more convoluted.
You say “Because of the trouble with FVD (here especially Rhonda and M&M)”. What trouble are you talking about here? Matthew and I have never had any trouble to my knowledge; to me we have been very respectful to one another. In fact, he apologized for his oversight in regards to this post, and I haven’t thought anything of it.
You go on to say, “have decided to cooperate in case of the 997 Turbo 2.Generation sport exhaust with an OE Porsche exhaust manufacturer which can not be announced right now.” Ok you can’t announce it right now, can you tell me this? Will your new OE Porsche exhaust supplier manufacture your valved and non valved exhaust’s in Germany?
You also state “We will not sell exhausts with any uncomfortable drone effect anymore.” Since a forum member pointed out your current supplier in post # 16, is that who you are referring to?
How about this comment? “The ECU of the new DFI engines from Porsche are controling the exhaust gas back pressure and "here it comes" the ECU adapts the values in the ECU back to a standard exhaust gas back pressure. That means: "No power increase without ECU update!" It is strange that we have shown the first exhaust of this type at the Essen Motorshow 2009. Since almost one year we have those informations about the power increase problem and make it public in every eMail, phone call or letter. Bad reputation to the Porsche tuning industry and this is the proof of somebodys inadequacy.”
Instead of emails, phone calls and letters, which are useless to your U.S. customers, perhaps you should add it on a website where it is more readily available.
Here is a link to GMP Performance’s website for 997.2 TT exhaust…
Here is what that link states...
997.2 Turbo Sport Muffler System
Porsche's 997.2 Turbo is already a phenomenal machine by any measure, but such precedents have never kept speedART from finding ways to improve upon Stuttgart's finest! Designed specifcially for the all-new 3.8L Turbo DFI engine, our Sport Muffler System liberates 30 additional horsepower and 30 lb-ft of torque, while producing a sound that could only come from a Porsche! In addition to the muffler, the kit also includes 200 cell high-flow catalytic converters, and all necessary hardware for installation. It's designed to work with either the factory tips, or speedART's GT2-Style single-round 100mm tips (see Related Items at bottom).
Also the related items at the bottom are tips, not software…
Now lets take a peak at the FVD website and “here it comes”….
FACTS:
- + 25 crank hp & + 19 crank torque (with FVD Software) **
- 200 Cell high flow, tri metal german HJS sport catalysts
- 2 3/4" tubing (70mm) straight through design for max. power
- Weighs 51 lbs. (23,0 Kg)
- T 316 stainless steel for improved durability over T 304
- 98dB at idle and partial rpms, 100 dB at wide open throttle
- Cone style catalytic connection design to prevent exhaust leaks
- Includes quick release clamps
- Made in Germany
- Modular design for 100 cell, 200 cell or bypass use
- Intoxicating growl at idle, partial throttle and wide open throttle
- No DME programming necessary.
Please Note:
Exhaust tips are not included! Stock tips will fit.
The tips pictured above can be purchased separately. They are "quad" 3.5" (90/100mm) tips and are made for this muffler. Kindly order BES 997 260 41S separately.
**Please Note:The 997.2 TT has a pressure sensor that measures backpressure. A lack of backpressure with any exhaust system and will be picked up by the sensor and adjust or reduce the power accordingly. With out a software file the exhaust system is just for sound only. Once a program is added you will achieve 580 + Hp
@Adrian speedArt: This is a free country my friend. I will talk about M&M being our supplier all day long, that’s my job. Exclusivity? In regards to a 997.2TT exhaust post, I think you have just made it abundantly clear that you are no longer selling M&M. Homework done!
Best regards Rhonda
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Rhonda Roxburgh
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FVD Brombacher - USA
Contact me directly to get the latest FVD forum member discount!
Rhonda Roxburgh
+1-954-571-2050 x 1
rhonda.roxburgh@fvd.net
Visit our online shop for an extensive selection of tuning and original parts www.fvd.net
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I have to agree with everything TTSurgeon has said and I emphasize the word everything. He is spot on. Drone and resonance are NOT the same thing in my book. Take for example a musical instrument, say a cello. The are some tones (frequencies) that resonate with the body of the instrument and produce the most marvelous sound you can imagine. Do we call that drone? Of course not. What people here are suggesting is that any kind of exhaust resonance even the smallest amount equates to drone. That is an incorrect depictor in my opinion. Drone in an exhaust has a much more negative conotation. If some people want to claim every exhausts drones, even the stock system, so be it. After all it's an opinion and opinions are subjective. I've tested and experienced several exhaust systems in a 997t and some drone and some do not. My current FVD system has no drone with or without cats. TTSurgeon prefers a less aggressive sound becuase of a hospital setting which I completely understand. I would be sheepish too in that environment. The FVD street system is absolutely awesome--no drone. The race verson is even "awesomer". It has all the same wonderful characteristics of the 200 cell system but more raw. You can clearly hear turbo whistle, off throttle gurgles, and then the FVD wail at WOT. A totally hairaising experience. Of course my windows always rolled down. On cold start and cruising, it's really pretty mild. This is a truly great exhaust. M&M knows what they are doing.
Last edited by TTdude; Sep 2, 2010 at 10:43 AM.
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I have to agree with everything TTSurgeon has said and I emphasize the word everything. He is spot on. Drone and resonance are NOT the same thing in my book. Take for example a musical instrument, say a cello. The are some tones (frequencies) that resonate with the body of the instrument and produce the most marvelous sound you can imagine. Do we call that drone? Of course not. What people here are suggesting is that any kind of exhaust resonance even the smallest amount equates to drone. That is an incorrect depictor in my opinion. Drone in an exhaust has a much more negative conotation. If some people want to claim every exhausts drones, even the stock system, so be it. After all it's an opinion and opinions are subjective. I've tested and experienced several exhaust systems in a 997t and some drone and some do not. My current FVD system has no drone with or without cats. TTSurgeon prefers a less aggressive sound becuase of a hospital setting which I completely understand. I would be sheepish too in that environment. The FVD street system is absolutely awesome--no drone. The race verson is even "awesomer". It has all the same wonderful characteristics of the 200 cell system but more raw. You can clearly hear turbo whistle, off throttle gurgles, and then the FVD wail at WOT. A totally hairaising experience. Of course my windows always rolled down. On cold start and cruising, it's really pretty mild. This is a truly great exhaust. M&M knows what they are doing.
One being on inside and one being on outside.
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If you say drone and resonance are two different things TTdude then you'd be hard pressed saying drone and resonance are not intimately interconnected. Without resonance you wont get drone and vice versa. Interior and exterior sound volumes may be called "different". One being on inside and one being on outside.
One being on inside and one being on outside.
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I had the two can/no joint tubi system, that clearly did not drone. I believe you had the single can version with multiple joints that is prone to droning. Apples and pears really.
Re the FVD systems, I have tried each and every one of their systems, they all have minimal resonance, as does the stock, but really no drone (as I define it) at all. Drone is when your wife screams at you to shift at ~ 3000rpm.
Anytime I had a problem with FVD, they happily sent a new item, etc. Their customer service is the best.
My only criticism of the EP1 is that it could actually be a tad louder...but be careful what you wish for...
Re the FVD systems, I have tried each and every one of their systems, they all have minimal resonance, as does the stock, but really no drone (as I define it) at all. Drone is when your wife screams at you to shift at ~ 3000rpm.
Anytime I had a problem with FVD, they happily sent a new item, etc. Their customer service is the best.
My only criticism of the EP1 is that it could actually be a tad louder...but be careful what you wish for...
In so far as FVD's gratuituos customer service, as good as it is im not convinced that is a panacea for drone. As i said earlier one should be realistically base ones expections upon P's own efforts with the stock system and work from that.
Re EP1, i would also agree one should be very careful with what one may wish for in terms of further increasing the exterior sound levels of the car without driving one self crazy in the process, afterall you can only be in one place at the one time (either inside the car or outside the car).
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When I read here that someone claims to have the FVD exhaust installed and tuck it off after 3! miles, it seams to me like trolling, wrong install or stupidity , or all. I just don't buy that. I had a lot of trouble with my 996TT because all systems (2 Fabspeed and a Tubi ) had so bad drone that I hated it till I replaced the car with a 997. Because I went through the 996 exhaust "horror" I did not think about replacing the stock exhaust here (the 997 sounds stock a lot better anyway and now I had cab) until I had the chance to hear the FVD "loud". I decided to give it a try (FVD gives a great satisfaction guarantee). After I did the install (myself) and started the car for the first time I was shocked wow loud it was, so I decided to let the system get warm and drove the car for 10 min, went under the car again and retightened all screws (this should always be done the system has to settle, this is one reason why I don't believe the 3 miles story). The sound that became quieter while warming up anyway, was now perfect. Never to loud (I am very sensitive) no drone or resonance not even between 2300 and 3000 rpm. It is just perfect--not to speak about the performance. You can even use your cellphone while on the road without any problems and mine is a cab. The FVD "loud" is not loud at all, only at wat it roars it just sounds good, not meant to turn heads or be obnoxious and inside it is slightly louder than stock, with same characteristic and no drone or resonance, by far the best exhaust for the Turbo I know ( I can't speak about the AWD, never seen -heard it, but know the others here mentioned). Just my 2 cents.***
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I assume you referred to my comment about "3 miles". So, let me troll once again.
I probably drove less than 3 miles because my attention span for these kind of things is rather short at this point. I have heard "It's a sports car", "It's normal for cars with that much power", "Well, it's a Porsche", "All Porsche exhausts do that", "You are just a sissy", etc. I have heard it all and I am glad I didn't buy any of it. I am happy with what I have now as the car sounds like a Porsche both inside and outside. I spent a lot of money during my exhaust saga but it's money well spent.
Myself and 2 other techs at Imola Motorsports in Minneapolis that I paid maybe 5 or 6 times to install and re-install various exhausts can vouch for my original comment. It didn't just drone, it also lost about 30-40wtq compared to EVOMS's 70mm system I had before then. It was THAT obvious on a tuned car with 580wtq. All 3 of us were in disbelief that exhaust could matter that much. We didn't just feel some difference, the sensation was "Is there something wrong?". Not sure if it was the ECU "re-learning" the new system... I really doubt that because both exhausts had 200 cell cats and 70mm piping. I suspect FVD's 70mm tip design is where most of the drone is coming from. Not sure what to think about lost torque. If I remember it correctly, it was their "medium" system. Could it be very different from the other ones and a bit more restrictive? I am not sure.
Anyway, the feedback has been submitted up the chain and I am sure they have looked into it. Oh, and Rhonda was absolutely fantastic to deal with!
I think we got derailed from the original track. 996Tter, if you have any followup questions feel free to PM me. Now back to 997.2 pipes.
I probably drove less than 3 miles because my attention span for these kind of things is rather short at this point. I have heard "It's a sports car", "It's normal for cars with that much power", "Well, it's a Porsche", "All Porsche exhausts do that", "You are just a sissy", etc. I have heard it all and I am glad I didn't buy any of it. I am happy with what I have now as the car sounds like a Porsche both inside and outside. I spent a lot of money during my exhaust saga but it's money well spent.
Myself and 2 other techs at Imola Motorsports in Minneapolis that I paid maybe 5 or 6 times to install and re-install various exhausts can vouch for my original comment. It didn't just drone, it also lost about 30-40wtq compared to EVOMS's 70mm system I had before then. It was THAT obvious on a tuned car with 580wtq. All 3 of us were in disbelief that exhaust could matter that much. We didn't just feel some difference, the sensation was "Is there something wrong?". Not sure if it was the ECU "re-learning" the new system... I really doubt that because both exhausts had 200 cell cats and 70mm piping. I suspect FVD's 70mm tip design is where most of the drone is coming from. Not sure what to think about lost torque. If I remember it correctly, it was their "medium" system. Could it be very different from the other ones and a bit more restrictive? I am not sure.
Anyway, the feedback has been submitted up the chain and I am sure they have looked into it. Oh, and Rhonda was absolutely fantastic to deal with!
I think we got derailed from the original track. 996Tter, if you have any followup questions feel free to PM me. Now back to 997.2 pipes.
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I have been following this and most other threads about exhausts for quite some time.
I am glad I did because I have learned alot and it has allowed me to reach a conclusion.
The conclusion I have drawn at this point in time is that I will keep my stock exhaust.
I am glad I did because I have learned alot and it has allowed me to reach a conclusion.
The conclusion I have drawn at this point in time is that I will keep my stock exhaust.