PDK, a loser???
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There have been many opinions in this thread, I have merely offered another. You could debate the points you made however we've been mostly confined to PDK vs. manual here.
FWIW, the speaker was Hurley Haywood at the Momentum Porsche Coffee & Cars event earlier this month and while I can't speak for Mr. Haywood I believe he is most likely aware of the leaps forward in engineering.
Nels
FWIW, the speaker was Hurley Haywood at the Momentum Porsche Coffee & Cars event earlier this month and while I can't speak for Mr. Haywood I believe he is most likely aware of the leaps forward in engineering.
Nels
i.e. traction control in F-1. I like the way they had it, and then did away with it.
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Hands down the 6 speed is more fun and engaging
Other than when in traffic the 6 speed blows away the paddles
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It is amazing to me how polarizing this discussion is and honestly I am saddened that so many people are quick to throw the manual transmission out the window. I have driven the finest paddle shift transmissions the world has seen, and no matter how fast it allows me to drive, and how much better it is around a track, it still can never compare to the pure feeling of connection that a manual transmission car gives you. I really don't care about lap times, 0-60 times, and shift times 24/7 - I care about the driving experience. I say this knowing full well what cars I own, but I must disclose that I will (hopefully) soon have a 997 GT2 to cap off my garage.
It pains me that people are "defecting" to the flappy paddle cars in such droves, but ultimately I hope that manufacturers will keep the option for us old school purists. It may be wishful thinking, but at least I am encouraged to see people who post and really "get it".
-m
It pains me that people are "defecting" to the flappy paddle cars in such droves, but ultimately I hope that manufacturers will keep the option for us old school purists. It may be wishful thinking, but at least I am encouraged to see people who post and really "get it".
-m
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I had the chance to drive my cousin's SMG m3 for a few hours while I owned a 6 speed M3. My biggest observation was that the car was a rocket on the freeway. Mostly because it selected the lowest possible gear. With a stick one might go from 6th 4th but this thing would drop down 2nd or 3rd and picked up a lot more speed. Liked it a lot. It was easy enough to take off the skid control, put it into a fast shift mode and click off shifts that unsettled the rear end (just like you'd drop the clutch or do hard up-shift in a manual) and allowed great slides.
SMGII in the e46 M3 is fine really, highly underrated and it has a very bad rap as it was ahead of it's time.
If you brought up this conversation here back when the E46 M3 came out you'd be laughed off the forums and I know many people who couldn't believe I bought my M3 without a standard stick shift. Now with literally 10 years of automotive progress since it's inclusion in the E46, DCT/PDK/SMG proliferation isn't so ridiculed anymore, but before it was barely acceptable to have and without really trying to get used to it people wrote it off immediately as too jerky / not smooth / I dont know what to do with my left foot / "it's an automatic!" etc.
You have to drive it like a manual with a computer controlling the clutch - once you get used to that and learn to use the proper shift speed based on how you're driving (s1-s6), it can be driven smooth as silk when you're cruising or menacingly raw and fast on the track. Maybe having a new 06 with the kinks worked out made a difference for me, too.
You mention "beaten" tons of SMGs - if you're talking straight line driving, SMG in the old M3 would definitely help you here as it was neutered in the US to only drop the clutch at 2000 RPM. Aside from messing around with friends I have never really street raced anyone in my life. I haven't even bothered "launching" my 997TT yet.
You are absolutely right, it really does come down to what you as an individual get the most enjoyment out of and where you have the most fun with the car, just defending the E46 SMG a little
If you brought up this conversation here back when the E46 M3 came out you'd be laughed off the forums and I know many people who couldn't believe I bought my M3 without a standard stick shift. Now with literally 10 years of automotive progress since it's inclusion in the E46, DCT/PDK/SMG proliferation isn't so ridiculed anymore, but before it was barely acceptable to have and without really trying to get used to it people wrote it off immediately as too jerky / not smooth / I dont know what to do with my left foot / "it's an automatic!" etc.
You have to drive it like a manual with a computer controlling the clutch - once you get used to that and learn to use the proper shift speed based on how you're driving (s1-s6), it can be driven smooth as silk when you're cruising or menacingly raw and fast on the track. Maybe having a new 06 with the kinks worked out made a difference for me, too.
You mention "beaten" tons of SMGs - if you're talking straight line driving, SMG in the old M3 would definitely help you here as it was neutered in the US to only drop the clutch at 2000 RPM. Aside from messing around with friends I have never really street raced anyone in my life. I haven't even bothered "launching" my 997TT yet.
You are absolutely right, it really does come down to what you as an individual get the most enjoyment out of and where you have the most fun with the car, just defending the E46 SMG a little
Last edited by Turbo Fanatic; Aug 22, 2011 at 11:10 PM.
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Let's face it. Porshe never made the most positive shifting manuals known to exist. Mostly due to the cable operation and tranny placement. The biggest achiles heel IMO was consistent launching ability. You either take your time shifting, or feel like you're hurting the car..
The single biggest aspect I miss with my porsche is teh fact that it's poor drag racer. Yes it's fast, but it doesn't feel at home doing it.
The single biggest aspect I miss with my porsche is teh fact that it's poor drag racer. Yes it's fast, but it doesn't feel at home doing it.
It is amazing to me how polarizing this discussion is and honestly I am saddened that so many people are quick to throw the manual transmission out the window. I have driven the finest paddle shift transmissions the world has seen, and no matter how fast it allows me to drive, and how much better it is around a track, it still can never compare to the pure feeling of connection that a manual transmission car gives you. I really don't care about lap times, 0-60 times, and shift times 24/7 - I care about the driving experience. I say this knowing full well what cars I own, but I must disclose that I will (hopefully) soon have a 997 GT2 to cap off my garage.
It pains me that people are "defecting" to the flappy paddle cars in such droves, but ultimately I hope that manufacturers will keep the option for us old school purists. It may be wishful thinking, but at least I am encouraged to see people who post and really "get it".
-m
It pains me that people are "defecting" to the flappy paddle cars in such droves, but ultimately I hope that manufacturers will keep the option for us old school purists. It may be wishful thinking, but at least I am encouraged to see people who post and really "get it".
-m
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), no one needs to be as fast as possible.You can only go so fast on public roads, and the idea is to have fun (safely) driving at spirited speeds, not getting to the office as quickly as possible. Likewise, the idea on the track is to improve driving skill and have fun doing it; beyond that, lap times are meaningless.
Of course, some people will want a fast car for bragging rights, but that's a whole different thing, and not something I put any value on. When people ask me how "fast" my Porsche is, I just
Last edited by Manifold; Aug 23, 2011 at 09:06 AM.
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I had the chance to drive my cousin's SMG m3 for a few hours while I owned a 6 speed M3. My biggest observation was that the car was a rocket on the freeway. Mostly because it selected the lowest possible gear. With a stick one might go from 6th 4th but this thing would drop down 2nd or 3rd and picked up a lot more speed. Liked it a lot. It was easy enough to take off the skid control, put it into a fast shift mode and click off shifts that unsettled the rear end (just like you'd drop the clutch or do hard up-shift in a manual) and allowed great slides.
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Let's face it. Porshe never made the most positive shifting manuals known to exist. Mostly due to the cable operation and tranny placement. The biggest achiles heel IMO was consistent launching ability. You either take your time shifting, or feel like you're hurting the car..
The single biggest aspect I miss with my porsche is teh fact that it's poor drag racer. Yes it's fast, but it doesn't feel at home doing it.
The single biggest aspect I miss with my porsche is teh fact that it's poor drag racer. Yes it's fast, but it doesn't feel at home doing it.
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I don't know, in Detrtoit here, we have the Woodward Dream Cruise where enthusiasts bring out their Shelby Cobras, Nitrous Super Sports, modded racers, Lambos, etc. Thousands of racers and classics. As evening approaches, the police back off as the shear number of cars driving down a 10 mile stretch on the 4 lane highway is too much.
In my Turbo S, I had the time of my life last Friday in racing a whole host of racers at 40 mph rolls and off the line at various stop lights. Just!!!
Launching and racing to speeds over 100 MPH was exhilarating. Must have done 20 races in the couple hours I was out. ... and I didn't miss a shift once!! (or lose for that matter). Like shooting fish in a barrel.
I had 2 Porsches with manual, but the PDK is the most fun (especially launching in Sport Plus)!
In my Turbo S, I had the time of my life last Friday in racing a whole host of racers at 40 mph rolls and off the line at various stop lights. Just
!!!Launching and racing to speeds over 100 MPH was exhilarating. Must have done 20 races in the couple hours I was out. ... and I didn't miss a shift once!! (or lose for that matter). Like shooting fish in a barrel.
I had 2 Porsches with manual, but the PDK is the most fun (especially launching in Sport Plus)!
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[quote=thebland;3294759]In my Turbo S, I had the time of my life last Friday in racing a whole host of racers at 40 mph rolls and off the line at various stop lights. Just !!!
Launching and racing to speeds over 100 MPH was exhilarating. Must have done 20 races in the couple hours I was out. ... and I didn't miss a shift once!! (or lose for that matter). Like shooting fish in a barrel./quote]
The difference may be that you have a Turbo S, whereas I have a mere C2S.
!!!Launching and racing to speeds over 100 MPH was exhilarating. Must have done 20 races in the couple hours I was out. ... and I didn't miss a shift once!! (or lose for that matter). Like shooting fish in a barrel./quote]
The difference may be that you have a Turbo S, whereas I have a mere C2S.
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