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I remember back in the day when Skandalis first posted his mid 6s 60-130 on stock vtgs and APR tune. We all thought it was BS. Turns out APR tune cranks up the boost to 1.6bar if not higher. Perhaps it can do 1 "ringer" 60-130 before pulling timing but I don't think anyone in North America was able to replicate the APR times.
I know that when I was testing different versions of the tune while Dzenno was fine tuning the first pass with the new versions was always wickedly fast. Now it's not as fast as the "peak" we had on a previous version but it's stable and consistent. But I can't forget that one run where I nailed it in 3rd gear and for the first time I had to hang on to the steering wheel. It was a 2.69s 60-100mph trip.
Man you are 100% dead on here with this comment!!!
The first pass when I upload the file is ALWAYS freaking fast! In fact the time has been accomplished immediately after uploading this file for the first time and car feels different every time we upload a fie for the first time! It is the first comment I made to the guys ever since we started tuning... ask Dzenno he will tell you!!! All I have asked from them now is the absolute best repeatble, reliable file they can come up with and we are at a pretty good stage at the moment... really happy with all the time and effort they are putting with me
Best time I could get in my car was 5.1, that was with 835whp (dynojet) and syvecs antilag. Very hard to believe this time. My car had a lot of mods too.
One thing about the vbox to keep in mind is that the accelerometer readings taken in a given instant (i.e. not a running average value but acceleration at time X for instance) can be questionable and doesn't need to reflect the vehicle's actual acceleration. In fact if you consider the way the device is mounted/installed inside the car and how quickly it can move in direction especially at the onset of WOT and especially if something like brake boosting, tranny shifting back/forth through gears, traction loss/re-gain, and shorter gears are used at start you can imagine how that could cause what is shown for the first roughly 0.8-0.9secs seconds of the run.
This is not how a vBox works. How do I know? I'm the guy that wrote the vBox Tools software you all are using @ vboxtools.com. The vBox does not store accelerometer data in the file. The hight G's aren't attributed to the vBox mounting, jiggling, etc., as the G's aren't stored in the file data. The G's are calculated based on rate of change of velocity; and actually they are averaged over two samples. The vboxtools.com software will give you the same exact result as the software by RaceLogic, when you select smooting=0.
This is not how a vBox works. How do I know? I'm the guy that wrote the vBox Tools software you all are using @ vboxtools.com. The vBox does not store accelerometer data in the file. The hight G's aren't attributed to the vBox mounting, jiggling, etc., as the G's aren't stored in the file data. The G's are calculated based on rate of change of velocity; and actually they are averaged over two samples. The vboxtools.com software will give you the same exact result as the software by RaceLogic, when you select smooting=0.
I hope this clears this up.
Very interesting. Good to know and thanks for sharing. Nice seeing you on this forum, love the work you've done with the vboxtools.com site. Racelogic's end user software is really poorly done and quite cumbersome for most people out there.
Last edited by proTUNING Freaks; Dec 2, 2014 at 09:43 PM.
Very interesting. Good to know and thanks for sharing. Nice seeing you on this forum, love the work you've done with the vboxtools.com site. Racelogic's end user software is really poor done and quite cumbersome for most people out there.
Thanks you, and you're welcome.
In the next version of vboxtools.com, I will add a feature to calculate WHP based on the vBox file. I've already done this in beta software at perfdb.org. As soon as I finish the user interface, I'll enable the feature at vboxtools.com. Then anybody who uses the feature will be able to generate his/her own WHP graphs along with the vBox verification results.
In the next version of vboxtools.com, I will add a feature to calculate WHP based on the vBox file. I've already done this in beta software at perfdb.org. As soon as I finish the user interface, I'll enable the feature at vboxtools.com. Then anybody who uses the feature will be able to generate his/her own WHP graphs along with the vBox verification results.
Best time I could get in my car was 5.1, that was with 835whp (dynojet) and syvecs antilag. Very hard to believe this time. My car had a lot of mods too.
Hello, sorry to quote on your post but I want to base my reply on this and it will have a more general meaning:
It is hard to believe a ONE time 5.9 from a 997.2 PDK runnnig some boost, but it is not hard to believe banned Wolfhedge's 996's stock K24 6.7 time???
It is hard to believe a one time 5.9 from a 3.8 liter DFI car at 7-10C ambient but it is ok to believe Adam's 6.5 time without a designated 60-130mph run while he we running in the dessert heat in side by side competitions heatsoaking the car to death...
It is hard to believe the 5.9 in 2015 from a modern car whose capabilities we are juist now beginning to exploit but it is ok to believe these:
I really do not understand why it is so hard to believe... Perhaps it is because I am from Greece (that I know most don't think high of).. Perhaps it is because Cobb is a newcomer in the Porsche world or perhaps and that is what I believe is most probably happening here it is until Adam with the many documented runs and accomplishments finds the right place and time and pulls a similar or lower time himself and then ALL will become believers!
Forgive me if I am wrong but wasn't it your car with the 835WHP and the 5.1 that ran very very close (for sure side by side until at least 130mph) with Adam's 6.5sec Giac 997.2PDK?
If it was not yours it was another black car with similar HP at an event a while ago...
I will end the story here... I am not interested to convince anyone. The time is legit... Maybe it will be repeated - maybe not! I will not play detective and analyse and decipher each and every time on this list to see what happened. Whoever choses to believe it it will be his gain... as was with the APR a few years back... and only "recently" Chris from USP proved us Greeks right when he did his own testing in his yellow 997tt!
997.2 PDK is a very potent car for a simple tune/exhaust combo - far more potent than 997.1 with similar mods ever was...
And a final comment for whoever is interested - peak HP is not the only thing when doing streetruns and even more 60-130mph... Torque plays a significant role and area under the curve, gearing, and shift speed (if there are any shifts that is ofcourse) are most important! Yes 835WHP vs 600WHP is a big difference, but so is 5.1 to 5.9 and also so is shifting manually (believe me I can do 0.2sec shifts) vs pdk and either way after 130mph your car would disappear in the horizon from mine... There at these speeds HP plays a mucho importante role my friend.
Sorry for all the drama the thread created. If anyone is offended or thinks that I lie for any reason or anything pls take the whole thing down... Sooner or later someone (or even I ) will do another similar or even better run and the truth will shine.
Nobody is questioning PTF, its the end users history that raises questions.
Personally I would like to see someone credit/discredit the points the other guy made, about pulling G's that would take much much more HP to do.
I know that Adam will get into low 6 - high 5's very very soon in such a run and i want to see what you (and everyone else will say then)...
I would say that your runs still dont make sense. You claim to only have a tune and exhaust with 100 cell cats. Adam has the same AND much improved intercoolers and still hasnt been able to get close to you....
I think it boils down to a few things and the reason I think the VBOX is total BS as a measuring device:
1. You have found the perfect hill to fall within the VBOX "rules" that gets you the best repeatable results and allows for that one time when the system makes an error or the hand of Zeus powers your car
2. You never have mentioned weight reduction (Seats, carpet etc)...you may not do it but you never mentioned it
3. VBOX is a computer that makes mistakes. Lets be realistic, while it is the most accurate system out there, it has glitches where it displays bad info or results
There is a reason why even you cant EVER replicate the runs. Frankly if the "mods" are going to use VBOX results they should be required to "back up" the run with identical results.
There is a reason why any sanctioning body requires results to be backed up (usually within a few hours of the original attempt)....NHRA, Salt Flats etc because computers arent perfect and they make mistakes.
Why not just get a vid up of a run? Or record one of the runs.
It would have saved alot of questions regarding the time and how you got it etc
cant video if hes cheating lol. also a video in this case would prove nothing since there are few ways to do what hes doing.
- it has more mods than he says ( which video will not show)
- its not in his car ( video would show that)
- consistently gets rear ended by Alpha12 GTR to get a 1.5G spike in accel to start his runs
- does runs off a cliff ( would explain why its non repeatable )
Originally Posted by madsex343
... Ok I will give you that the M3 was unprecedented and unbelievable
all your "world records" are unprecedented and unbelievable and should have a big * next to them.
i dont even wanna hear about the greek gasoline that equates to our 94-95. you can put MS109 in a car with your mods and its still not gonna run the times you run. same thing with your M3, you can fill an M3 with C16, Q16 whatever you want and its not doing those times.... even a car with a 100 shot and weight reduction was slower than you.
anyone who believes that 997 with tune and exhaust or a 550whp M3 with 400 ft-lbs of torque can achieve Buggati Veyron like 60-130 times should check themselves and spend some time reading the 60-130 thread.
There is a reason why even you cant EVER replicate the runs. Frankly if the "mods" are going to use VBOX results they should be required to "back up" the run with identical results.
If there is no cheating, the runs must be replicable within a certain time window. Like these:
I think he's explained it several times that these are "ringer" runs when a new tune is first put on. I had the same experience (but not those times!). It's not repeatable because the tune is a little aggressive and after the first run timing gets pulled....
