Methyl Tert Butyl Ether?


Where?

 

Yes, there is a standard. The standard profit margin for the business selling you the fuel. Cold starts on E85 in cooler temperatures can be pretty tricky though. When it gets near freezing you need ~300% extra fuel to get it to light off. That's why they increase the gasoline in the mix in the colder months. I just take my trusty test tube with me and check it for fun at the gas station. I have had all kinds of strange interactions with people while doing this.

For example, there was the Porschephile who came running across the parking lot yelling at me to take the (yellow) E85 nozzle out of the car. It was horribly corrosive, and my car not being a flex fuel vehicle could not use it. Shame on me for trying to save money, didn't I know that you get much worse gas mileage with it anyway?

Then there was the guy who thought I was a terrorist and trying to set the pumps on fire because I put some fuel in my test tube and was looking at it funny. I guess he thought water + E85 = detonator.

At any rate, if you read all of that you deserve some information. YES C85 does have MTBE. *MOST* modern injectors are MTBE safe. ID1000, ID1300, ID1700, etc. are all MTBE safe. The only one you have to watch out for is the ID2000 which was originally a natural gas injector design (I think?) which is not MTBE compatible. An earlier post mentions something about "stainless internals" being necessary for MTBE compatibility - that's not actually true. It's the orings/seals in the injector that swell when exposed to MTBE that are the problem. All of the aforementioned sizes of Injector Dynamics (1000/1300/1700) are MTBE safe and not a problem. Since they are based on Bosch EV14 injectors, those are safe too.

 

Rix, we would be best friend if you were closer! That's funny! Had similar experience's.


Just stay away from the green pump! Also keep clear of H20 E85 mixture especially, when the sun starts to drop.


Colder starts are harder for sure during the cold months. My heated 70F garage still presents a harder start on E90.


BTW, I typically pump into a 1 gal tank and test the day prior to pumping the car.


I also haven't seen much more fuel consumption at the track over my 100oct. tune. I use 2-3 gallons more per 30 min. run.

 

tuning is the key! when o had the proof installed my car basically would take 5 minutes to start on a sub 40* day. garth form u/c was my tuner. he worked on the cold start files and the car improved with every file installed. last setup had the car starting close to stock in sub 30* on e85. he told me below 50* the e85 stops atomizing and becomes ever so thick. hard to pass that in the cylinders. but he got it dialed in

i also thought a fuel tank heater like the ones used in big rig diesel tanks might help to keep the fuel warm in really cold temps

 

Rix is correct on the injectors (id2000) and the bosche 160lbs that proto use don't like MBTE.

I learnt the lesson the hard way with c85 and 160lbs injectors. Now running the 1300cc injectors on e85 with no issues.

https://m.facebook.com/InjectorDynamics/posts/565285696856709

 

Interesting. Thanks for the link!

 

Yes with a 5BAR 750-850BHP = 80-90% injector duty & your safe within those parameters.

 

I think you guys are looking at it in a very logical way, but consider a different way to judge what injector put put in the car.

It's pretty safe to assume that the lower the injector duty cycle is better. There are a few reasons why. For starters, you don't want to be squirting fuel on the back of a closed intake valve. Modern injectors are a lot better, but you can still run into spray pattern issues when you are just leaving the injector on 100% of the time. You can raise fuel pressure to artificially increase the size of the fuel injector, but fuel pumps flow a lower volume - and at a higher temperature - the higher the fuel pressure is.

On the bright side, the higher you rev the engine the less time you have to inject fuel. That's an advantage for us because we're not typically revving to 9500rpm like other platforms.

The best injector for your car is the largest thing you can possibly stuff in it that has a small enough and consistent enough delivery to idle the car on your chosen fuel. For gasoline on these cars thats probably the ID1300. If you're running E85 you can idle smoothly on the ID1700. Don't look at it from how much injector you think you need now, just get the biggest thing you can. Dropping the engine in these cars to install new injectors is way more expensive between the difference in price between a ID850 and an ID1300.

 

i have seen 2 large rwhp both 996 and 997 idle like stock on 2000 cc injectors. most anything above 700 rwhp on e85 needs more than 1300cc the id 1700 is a nice injector but for the price you can buy 2 sets of fid 2000cc injectors

 

FIC you mean? I wouldn't put anything other than Injector Dynamics on my engine, although everyone is free to choose. The reason I shy away from the 2000cc is because they are not MTBE compatible.

Tony @ T1/Injector Dynamics had told me that in order to idle right at stoich the 1700 was as big as he would go for the 911. Unless of course you are doing dual injectors per cylinder and then you can do all kinds of fun stuff .

 

This is also true & is part of the over all calculations especially the higher you rev.....8000.9000,10000rpms (some 2J's etc) .


I believe in one of my post I mentioned that this is the "basics" and there is more to it then what I wrote. Pulse width was another parameter I was going to go in, but the for-mentioned I thought was more then enough as our cars "typically" do not rev high and mostly live in the 7000-7500rpm's range after modified.

 

fid injectors. i ran 1300 id injectors and they are very good. seats car idles fine dhalens car idles fine at 800 rpm. dhalan is on smaller injectors but seats car idles like stock with 2000cc injectors. all he runs is e85 and has had zero issues. layinbacks car had fic 2150 injectors and idled fine as well

i don't run c16 or race gas only e85 and 93 so i haven't ever had any compatibility issues the shop i use is building dual injector rails ut that would even harder to fine tune on a stock dme for the 996. maybe the 997 would be easier i don't know. I'm on proefi so it can be done and may need to be if the 2000 run out of duty cycle with the turbos i have

 

ID2000 is no problem at all for idling on E85 due to the 30% extra fuel required. I think it's a bit of a challenge on 93 octane though. Sounds like we're pretty much on the same page.

I haven't seen FID before guess I'll have to look into them. I *am* biased though, Injector Dynamics has such a quality product and team backing them I can't see recommending anything else to people.

 

after the fantastic customer support i got from id i was a solid customer. when the build got a bit out of hand the 1700 just isn't enough and of course is the most expensive injector they sell. i could wait until sean builds the 12 injector setup but that could take months considering all the current orders he has to complete and the other projects he is developing. my car has been down for almost a solid yr with this build and I'm just really wanting to have it back running , going to car shows and racing. so on his experience with the fid 2000 and the real time data he has since they are on his car i went with my builders suggestion.

 

Great info guys,


Krazy32, did ID really confirm that 1700 was the max they could support? I would think an adapter could be created from their highly supported GT-R platform.