Fuel wise, how does e85 compare to 93+75% meth injection in terms of ability to tune for increased boost and timing?
i have read that stock VTGs are great but susceptible to inefficiency from excessive intake air temps when pushed to higher boost levels. My thinking is that combatting this heat with aftermarket ICs combined with meth injection for charge cooling can expand the performance envelope of the stock VTGs.
Running 100oct with 75% meth injection with quality aftermarket ICs and a full 3” exhaust with cat bypass pipes and a custom Cobb pro tune is it reasonable to expect 600 whp using stock VTGs and injectors?

 

or run e85 AND meth injection

 

I'm sure that would be optimal but I'm not planning on doing an e85 conversion and I already have a 100oct map installed with 50/50 meth injection for cooling and consistency only at this point. Interesting idea though
I'm really just looking for feedback on what can be achieved with the stock VTGs and injectors using available tools to help with their weak spots. My logs show I am pushing 22.5psi on overboost with the current tune and it feels comparable to my A28 equipped 996TT on 100 octane.

 

That's the way to go.

 

So you are already running 100 octane and 50/50 methanol injection? Have you dyno'd the car on this combo? I'd suspect you'd be at 600 wheel HP. I doubt you'd see a big difference if you switched to from 50% meth to 75% methanol. No doubt you'd be well above 600 wheel HP with larger VTG's.

As for the question of e85 vs. 93 oct + 75% meth.......I can tell you that my car made 750 wheel HP on 91 Octane + Methanol (80%), and on e85 with no meth it made 850 wheel HP. So in my case, the e85 allowed more timing and boost than 91 + meth. Obviously, 93+meth will be better than 91+meth, but I'd assume that e85 will still be better than 93+meth. For reference, my car is a 3.8L 997.1TT with XR1000 turbo's, AMS IC's, ID1300 injectors, full GMG exhaust with 200 cell sport cats , etc.

 

Are the XR1000 turbos the same as the Xona XR5756?

 

I'm not sure to be honest- the XR1000 are the updated and slightly upsized version of the older XR980.

 

Great info, thank you. I am tuned for everything except the meth right now. I’m just using it just to control IATs right now but I am open to using it for a small increase of power. The failsafes are known to be very reliable on the HFS 3. On 100 octane running 50% meth just for cooling it is already plenty powerful so I’ll probably work with my tuner just to make sure the map is updated to safely use it and take advantage of it without going crazy. I can’t imagine trying to push these turbos beyond the 22.5 psi they are currently delivering is a good idea since they weren’t intended to operate at that level.

 

I totally understand not wanting to tune aggressively to depend on meth. I run a 91 + meth tune as my daily driver tune, and it does make more power than 91 alone- roughly 60-70 more HP at the tires than 91 alone. But according to Sam (ByDesign), it's not so aggressive that my motor will blow if it fails. I'm very meticulous in keeping the methanol tank squeaky clean, filled, and I frequently check for leaks. For me, it's an awesome solution in that I can run a tune equivalent to 95 or 98 octane for the cost of occasionally filling my methanol tank. On the west coast with crappy 91 pump fuel, this is a godsend.

Good luck!

 

Sam is my tuner as well and he is very cautious when using methanol for power increases. That is the kind of tuner I like working with considering the cost of serious engine damage when leaving no safety buffer while extracting every last bit of power. I just got the car back from having the engine out for coolant fitting pinning and preventative maintenance but there is a very small amount seeping out of the system somewhere finding its way to the floor after the car sits for a couple days so I will be without it all next week or longer until the shop gets it resolved. After that I'm going to send some logs on 100 + 50% meth and ask Sam to see if he is comfortable pushing the power a bit further. I think it would make sense to log with the meth system active just to be sure it is being used efficiently and adjust the tune accordingly.
I don't know what meth setup you are running but the Aquamist HFS3.1 has a multiple failsafes and I have never had an issue with it in this car or in my 996T which also had the same model installed. I miss the roads in California but not the crappy gas

 

Sorry about your coolant leak- that's a bit frustrating. My meth system is a custom built system done by Sam and World motorsports. It is a Prometh tank and pump, and all aviation grade fittings and plumbing, with a Snow Performance controller in the place of the sport chrono on the dash. It's very well integrated.

Yes, the roads here are great- I live in the Sierra Nevada foothills and the back canyon roads are never ending and start 3 minutes from where I live. But there are plenty of other issues here in the state that leave a bit to be desired! Indeed the 91 octane is one of them.

 

Your methanol setup sounds better than anything available off the shelf - very nice. I thought the sport chrono feature was so cool when I first got the car but quickly realized I was never going to use it. During the install of my Aquamist gear I couldn't believe how easy it was to swap out the clock for my gauge. It's such a great fit it almost looks like a factory option.
Florida and California both have their ups and downs but I guess that is true of most states. Earthquakes or Hurricanes - pick your poison. One thing about FL I didn't know until I moved here was the lack of any emissions testing requirements. That was a nice surprise!

 

I love FL. I did a trip this past summer starting in Pensacola, heading head along the gulf coast, then over to St. Augustine and up to Amelia island. I also spent some time in Pensacola and Panama City when I was USN active duty. Also I’ve spent time down on the keys over the years. I may well find myself in FL When I’m done working.... great state!! Enjoy it!

 

I'm way off topic here now but one good thing about FL vs CA - when I was still working in the office in Silicon Valley I was always one of the oldest people in every situation (i'm in my late 40s). Here in FL its like I'm a kid again! Just about everyone is older than me
Back to the post - I just got a new map from Sam for 100 + 75% meth (his recommendation) last night. He is so great at responding it's almost like he has a team of clones. I don't know how he is able to get back to me nights, weekends anytime within an hour usually! I reached out last night and told him my goals for the inclusion of my new meth setup into my 100 octane map. He modified my map and sent back a new file right away. While he is more knowledgeable on the Snow system he was able to tell me how he would like me to set up my HFS3 and he tunes in safeguards on the map in addition to the built in Aquamist failsafes. Another thing he said that I found interesting is that he doesn't rely on the meth system for safety and always leaves a buffer in the tune so the ECU safeguards can prevent engine failure. This might be at the cost of extracting a bit less power but I am 100% behind this method.

 

Keep us posted!

Indeed Sam Ahdoot is beyond awesome. He is really a phenomenal asset to our community.