I posted a similar thread on rennlist.

There seems to be a great deal of confusion about voiding warranties if you have modified your car. For example, I have heard the following:

-Any detectable ECU modification that destroys some system on your car will void the warranty.

-Aftermarket exhausts are okay, from the cats back to the tailpipes, but pre-cat components such as headers will void the warranty in the case of damage.

-Any track damage is not covered (insurance may cover first instance)

One final note - I believe that my car will come with a 4 year, 50K mile warranty. However, if I bring it back the following day, my dealer said he will perform the 100 (or however many) steps for preowned, certification, and extend the warranty to 6 years, 100K miles. Does anyone have any experience with this?

Thanks in advance - Gerry
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Most I've seen are overrevs.. I saw a steering problem also here on 6speed, and the dealer was blaming the pss9..LOL

 

Not so sure about mufflers....a good Porsche mechanic I use, says adding the exhaust could void the warranty depending on what kind of damage. He says often with exhaust, some techs just over look it. I am going to check more because I would like to add one of the new muffler systems offered by AWE tuning.

BMW will not do the certification thing after 50Kmiles for the original owner. Don't know about Porsche, didn't ask, but I doubt it. I just bought the 100K warranty from the dealer when I got my '07tt. It included free tires for any tire damage for the life of the tire.

 

Isn't there new PIWIS software that will check for any re-chipping and report it? Vender's such as Revo, GIAC, etc say they are undetectable, but with the new software, they show up. Porsche had already issued a TSB bulletin when the 996 Turbo first came out that any DME (ECU) tampering will void the warranty.

See http://www.renntech.org/forums/index...d+warranty+dme

 

The only warranty problem with an aftermarket exhaust may be the use of 200 cell cats. Does altering the emission equipment void the warranty?

 

Hey guys, maybe I can help clarify this issue, being a certified Porsche tech at a dealer.

In regards to the question of aftermarket mods voiding the warranty... I forget the specific case, but there was a huge lawsuit dealing with this matter that basically says that in order for a warranty repair to be denied, the suspected modification has to be pinpointed as the cause of the problem. Some quick Googling will find you this case/law.

Yes it is possible for us to see if the vehicle has been flashed with the PIWIS tester, but you would have to have something seriously wrong with you to not be able to tell if a car is flashed or not, we all know how much of a difference they make.

The certified warranty issue, in order for a dealer to grant the extended warranty, you would have to purchase the car, then have the dealer buy it back from you, perform the certification checksheet and then re-sell it to you. A lot of hassle if you ask me(not to mention expensive).

Altering the emmision equipment will give you problems with emission inspection in your respective state, may cause warranty problems.

As always, take what I say with a grain of salt. I cannot, and do not try to speak for every one at PCNA. I view myself as a mod-friendly tech, as I mod my own cars. I have even gotten into friendly arguments with unamed people from PCNA about this kind of stuff .

I will be hanging around this forum from now on, so if you have any questions like this, I would be glad to try and provide answers.

Kevin H

 

The act you're refering to prohibits a manufacturer(Ford) from compeling consumers to use motorcraft disposable parts(mufflers, filters, etc) to preserve a warranty. I believe it's the Magnuson-Moss Act, Chris(e55amg) would know for sure.
They must be able to prove that the particular mod caused the failure, ie an ecu flash and catastrophic type 2 failure.
Exhausts are one thing, but an ecu flash on a 130k car on my dime might be pushing it a bit. jmo

 

Kevin H, do you know if this ^^ is accurate, can new systems detect the newest software?

 

Magnusson Moss Act

http://www.answers.com/topic/magnuss...s-warranty-act

 

Thanks for the information! I got more thoughtful responses here than other forums (and I was a founder of the porschephiles list back in '92).

I read the act, and you are correct, it seems to place the burden of proof on the dealer.

I talked with Michael Bartsch, COO of PCNA, and he said that the ECU would void if they could prove it, but usually exhausts aren't a big cause for concern. He also said they do have software that can detect whether an ECU's map had been altered at some time. I have no way to know whether that is true or not. I am probably now "red-flagged' in PCNA's database. There is a great deal of gray area in all of this, as one might expect.

In general, my dealings with Porsche dealers have been terrible. They have lied, performed shoddy mechanics on my cars. Once dealer performed a PIP and gave a used RSA I was thinking of buying a clean bill of health, saying it had never been in an accident - and it had been in a bad accident at Summit Point which cost $17k worth of repairs which they had known about (I got the paperwork from Dave Coleman's place at Summit Point). It pays to perform extra due diligence. BTW - that was the Porsche dealership in Charlottesville, VA.

I think I may have found a good, but small local one now, but we shall see.

They did offer to do the 6 year, 100K certification for free without buying the car back or asking for money.

Thanks to everyone! - Gerry

 

Yes we can tell when a car has been flashed, by looking at the number of "programming operations" stored in the DME. As of right now, our PIWIS tester is not on some sort of global network that conects it to PAG (although it is in the near future) to report such things as flashes.

Kevin

 

Yes, it's the Magnuson Moss act. Just remember one thing - although this law exists you will most likely end up having to sue Porsche (or any manufacturer) to prove your case. they will keep it in court while your car sits and your making payments.

exhausts shouldn't be a problem but ECU's are a no no. My E55 was modded and the dealer wasn't very thrilled about it - and I had a tremendous relationship with them. Bought 6-7 cars from them in a 5 yr. period or so. I had an issue with my E55 when after the 2nd time it happened (no codes were thrown) the V.P. of the dealership offered me a new car (could have been a potential safety issue), no questions asked (the added bonus is that she is HOT!). I said no thanks, let's just try to find the problem. This was before the car was modded otherwise they would have blamed the mods.
I got to know the US manager for AMG and he told me they HATE modded cars and will do whatever they can to void the warranty. Your car will be flagged in their system. My dealer would still service my car but if there was a problem I was screwed. They even tried to point to my premature cracking of rotors as being caused by the "chip" in my car. This comment still stuns me to this day. I asked them how a "chip" could cause my brakes to fail early. I used the analogy of having two E55's - one modded the other stock. Run them both from 0-150 and what happens? The modded car might get there a bit quicker but they both have to stop from 150. They didn't get it.

I used to argue with other AMG owners all the time. All I heard was how great their dealer was, they sold and installed the mods, etc. etc. I don't care how great your dealer is. Blow an engine and they will be calling in the regional tech. Say bye bye to your warranty.

I would suggest speaking with your dealer first and yes, it help a lot to find a "mod-friendly" dealer. Just realize that if the **** hits the fan assume you will lose, or will have to sue them - maybe you'll win.

I plan on doing an exhaust immediately and at some point will most likely do an ECU but not right away.

 

oh ok, thanks man, my girlfriend has an 07 cayman and was thinking about a flash or something.. think we will stay away from then then..