Next (Fun to drive) Car? 981 Boxster S vs. '11 Spyder vs. 997.2 Carrera S
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Next (Fun to drive) Car? 981 Boxster S vs. '11 Spyder vs. 997.2 Carrera S
Hello everyone! It's that exciting time for me to buy a new Porsche. I will probably buy one around my birthday in January so I've been doing research. I'd love to have everyone's input.
Background
I currently drive a Black/black 987 Boxster S and it's time to upgrade.
I autocross in the summers and would like to join more HPDE events.
I loved the feedback from the steering, the seating position, the responsiveness, the sound of my Fabspeed Race header.
I didn't like the drone, relatively boring the lack of bluetooth/ipod connectivity, the lack of torque.
I'm definitely looking for a driver's car and definitely a manual transmission.
For example, I drove the 997.2 Turbo and although the acceleration was perfect, I didn't like the power delivery- I would probably prefer the GT3.
I also don't like the electronic steering in the 981-S and 991-S. I IMMEDIATELY noticed how numb it feels in comparison to my 987-S. I think I can maybe live with electronic steering; at least I hope.
My ideal car would probably the 981 Boxster GTS/Spyder, but right now I have other financial plans.
These are the Porsches in the price range that I'm willing to spend. I'm leaning towards the 981-S, especially after hearing how amazing it sounds, but the Boxster Spyder is a very close 2nd- so close that if the only 981-S available was black (I don't want another black car) and a Spyder was available in red (I really want a red Porsche), then I'd probably go for the Spyder lol.
I have 3 top choices:
1. 2013 981 Boxster S
Good:
-Updated/modern exterior
-Beautiful interior
-AMAZING/PERFECT sound (will prob get a Borla exhaust). This is a huge plus. This is exactly how I want a car to sound like.
-Awesome keyfob
-All the interior/exterior parts I'm willing to buy to make it more special (Alcantara wheel/****/center console, red seatbelts, red tach, etc) Similar to the GTS.
Bad:
-I've test driven this car extensive times on the track and around town and it hardly felt quicker than my Boxster S w/my Fabspeed Race Header. I always wanted "pin you into your seat" acceleration like the 997 Turbo. Even when I drove the 991-S, I wasn't very excited by the feel of acceleration. I would probably add some bolt-ons.
-It's just another "Boxster S". It's nothing special like the Spyder or even the GTS.
-Electronic steering. Relatively numb and uncommunicative. I would rather have hydraulic steering.
2. 2011 997.2 Boxster Spyder
Good:
-Special car. How often do you meet someone with a Boxster Spyder? This is a huge plus in my book.
-Rear Farings. Amazing. Reminiscent of the 550 Spyder. I love it! I'm all about Porsche history.
-Door pulls. Awesome.
-Top. I don't care that it takes an extra 2 minutes of my life to put the top up or down. It would just remind me that I've driving something that much more special.
-Hydraulic steering
Bad:
-Haven't driven one yet
-Availability. It's difficult to find one in the low 50k range. I feel they are worth low 50s. I've seen many sell for that price.
-Older exterior. It's not a huge change from my current Boxster S minus the rear farings.
-Older interior. Again very similar to my current interior.
-Sound. Most likely I will get the Fabspeed Race Header again. It will probably sound similar to my car and I will still have that drone.
-Acceleration feel. It's probably similar in acceleration feel to the 981-S. I would prob add some bolt-ons.
3. 997.2 Carrera S
Good:
-Acceptable Acceleration. Honestly, if I had a choice, this would be the minimum I would like to have my car feel in terms of acceleration. I would LOVE to have my car feel as quick as a 996/997 Turbo, but I'd settle for the 997.2 S acceleration. I just love the thrill when I step on the gas.
-It's the iconic 911. It just has a certain mystique to it.
-4 Seats. Even if it's very tight, I can really use the backseats because there are times when I travel with 2 other people.
-I love the classic shape and the road presence of the bigger/wider 911.
Bad:
-Just another 911. I love the classic shape, but it's prob the least inspiring looking out of the 3.
-Higher Insurance
-Bigger and not as nimble. I love the size of my Boxster S.
Close 4th would be the 996 Turbo. The interior is just too old so I don't think I'd be able to live with it.
Thank you!
Background
I currently drive a Black/black 987 Boxster S and it's time to upgrade.
I autocross in the summers and would like to join more HPDE events.
I loved the feedback from the steering, the seating position, the responsiveness, the sound of my Fabspeed Race header.
I didn't like the drone, relatively boring the lack of bluetooth/ipod connectivity, the lack of torque.
I'm definitely looking for a driver's car and definitely a manual transmission.
For example, I drove the 997.2 Turbo and although the acceleration was perfect, I didn't like the power delivery- I would probably prefer the GT3.
I also don't like the electronic steering in the 981-S and 991-S. I IMMEDIATELY noticed how numb it feels in comparison to my 987-S. I think I can maybe live with electronic steering; at least I hope.
My ideal car would probably the 981 Boxster GTS/Spyder, but right now I have other financial plans.
These are the Porsches in the price range that I'm willing to spend. I'm leaning towards the 981-S, especially after hearing how amazing it sounds, but the Boxster Spyder is a very close 2nd- so close that if the only 981-S available was black (I don't want another black car) and a Spyder was available in red (I really want a red Porsche), then I'd probably go for the Spyder lol.
I have 3 top choices:
1. 2013 981 Boxster S
Good:
-Updated/modern exterior
-Beautiful interior
-AMAZING/PERFECT sound (will prob get a Borla exhaust). This is a huge plus. This is exactly how I want a car to sound like.
-All the interior/exterior parts I'm willing to buy to make it more special (Alcantara wheel/****/center console, red seatbelts, red tach, etc) Similar to the GTS.
Bad:
-I've test driven this car extensive times on the track and around town and it hardly felt quicker than my Boxster S w/my Fabspeed Race Header. I always wanted "pin you into your seat" acceleration like the 997 Turbo. Even when I drove the 991-S, I wasn't very excited by the feel of acceleration. I would probably add some bolt-ons.
-It's just another "Boxster S". It's nothing special like the Spyder or even the GTS.
-Electronic steering. Relatively numb and uncommunicative. I would rather have hydraulic steering.
2. 2011 997.2 Boxster Spyder
Good:
-Special car. How often do you meet someone with a Boxster Spyder? This is a huge plus in my book.
-Rear Farings. Amazing. Reminiscent of the 550 Spyder. I love it! I'm all about Porsche history.
-Door pulls. Awesome.
-Top. I don't care that it takes an extra 2 minutes of my life to put the top up or down. It would just remind me that I've driving something that much more special.
-Hydraulic steering
Bad:
-Haven't driven one yet
-Availability. It's difficult to find one in the low 50k range. I feel they are worth low 50s. I've seen many sell for that price.
-Older exterior. It's not a huge change from my current Boxster S minus the rear farings.
-Older interior. Again very similar to my current interior.
-Sound. Most likely I will get the Fabspeed Race Header again. It will probably sound similar to my car and I will still have that drone.
-Acceleration feel. It's probably similar in acceleration feel to the 981-S. I would prob add some bolt-ons.
3. 997.2 Carrera S
Good:
-Acceptable Acceleration. Honestly, if I had a choice, this would be the minimum I would like to have my car feel in terms of acceleration. I would LOVE to have my car feel as quick as a 996/997 Turbo, but I'd settle for the 997.2 S acceleration. I just love the thrill when I step on the gas.
-It's the iconic 911. It just has a certain mystique to it.
-4 Seats. Even if it's very tight, I can really use the backseats because there are times when I travel with 2 other people.
-I love the classic shape and the road presence of the bigger/wider 911.
Bad:
-Just another 911. I love the classic shape, but it's prob the least inspiring looking out of the 3.
-Higher Insurance
-Bigger and not as nimble. I love the size of my Boxster S.
Close 4th would be the 996 Turbo. The interior is just too old so I don't think I'd be able to live with it.
Thank you!
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You forgot to add a few pointers:
The Spyder/997.2 are the last of the 997 era- meaning the cars will more than likely be much more reliable in the long run than a 981 first year production car.
The Boxster S is nothing "special" either, the 911s wins by miles when it comes to being Special.
The Spyder and 911 will have absolutely excellent resale values at this point. You need to be ready to take a bigger financial hit with the 981 Boxster S.
If this is your Only car and you need/want the updated nav and interior I can understand your desire for the 981.
My personal solution to this is having a daily driver with all the updated tech (BMW is much better than Porsche when it comes to nav and such) .
I still love my old 997.1 I've had for the past 5 years; the longest I have ever owned any vehicle. It is the most challenging car to learn as it is RR.
I've been to Muholland hwy countless times in my car in the past years and I feel that the last time I went up I was the fastest. The experience and learning to Fully utilize the RR platform is like no other . Most 911 owners sell their cars without ever exploring the limits.
You can hop into a Boxster or any 50/50 weight ratio car and rip turns like no other . Heck, every single BMW car for sale (I mean every single) is now 50/50 weight distribution.
I'm not talking down on the 987/981 platforms. I love them; Especially the Spyder. They handle on rails and are very confidence inspiring in the canyons . The 981 Cayman was just so easy to drive and so fast.
But there is an experience that Only the 911 can offer.
Let the 50 years talk for itself.
The Spyder/997.2 are the last of the 997 era- meaning the cars will more than likely be much more reliable in the long run than a 981 first year production car.
The Boxster S is nothing "special" either, the 911s wins by miles when it comes to being Special.
The Spyder and 911 will have absolutely excellent resale values at this point. You need to be ready to take a bigger financial hit with the 981 Boxster S.
If this is your Only car and you need/want the updated nav and interior I can understand your desire for the 981.
My personal solution to this is having a daily driver with all the updated tech (BMW is much better than Porsche when it comes to nav and such) .
I still love my old 997.1 I've had for the past 5 years; the longest I have ever owned any vehicle. It is the most challenging car to learn as it is RR.
I've been to Muholland hwy countless times in my car in the past years and I feel that the last time I went up I was the fastest. The experience and learning to Fully utilize the RR platform is like no other . Most 911 owners sell their cars without ever exploring the limits.
You can hop into a Boxster or any 50/50 weight ratio car and rip turns like no other . Heck, every single BMW car for sale (I mean every single) is now 50/50 weight distribution.
I'm not talking down on the 987/981 platforms. I love them; Especially the Spyder. They handle on rails and are very confidence inspiring in the canyons . The 981 Cayman was just so easy to drive and so fast.
But there is an experience that Only the 911 can offer.
Let the 50 years talk for itself.
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....
You forgot to add a few pointers:
The Spyder/997.2 are the last of the 997 era- meaning the cars will more than likely be much more reliable in the long run than a 981 first year production car.
True. Although I would only keep the car for about 3-4 years as I am looking to get into a GT3/Turbo in the long run.
The Boxster S is nothing "special" either, the 911s wins by miles when it comes to being Special.
Yes, I did mention that. I will definitely have to say the Spyder would be special than the 911. Spyder>911-S>Boxster S.
The Spyder and 911 will have absolutely excellent resale values at this point. You need to be ready to take a bigger financial hit with the 981 Boxster S.
Very true. I'm keeping this in mind.
If this is your Only car and you need/want the updated nav and interior I can understand your desire for the 981.
My personal solution to this is having a daily driver with all the updated tech (BMW is much better than Porsche when it comes to nav and such) .
Yea, it'll be my only car. I don't care much for navi as I will always use my phone's Waze app. It alerts me when there's a cop as well as other things. I just want a nice, updated interior.
I still love my old 997.1 I've had for the past 5 years; the longest I have ever owned any vehicle. It is the most challenging car to learn as it is RR.
I've been to Muholland hwy countless times in my car in the past years and I feel that the last time I went up I was the fastest. The experience and learning to Fully utilize the RR platform is like no other . Most 911 owners sell their cars without ever exploring the limits.
You can hop into a Boxster or any 50/50 weight ratio car and rip turns like no other . Heck, every single BMW car for sale (I mean every single) is now 50/50 weight distribution.
I'm not talking down on the 987/981 platforms. I love them; Especially the Spyder. They handle on rails and are very confidence inspiring in the canyons . The 981 Cayman was just so easy to drive and so fast.
But there is an experience that Only the 911 can offer.
Let the 50 years talk for itself.
Hmm, I've enjoyed my Boxster S so much that I can only hope for the same thing, but slightly quicker+more grip. I've explored the limits of it during Auto-X with and without PSM. That's why I don't want so much of a change. Mid-Engine is debately the superior platform. I'd like to see a test comparing the GT4 with a 997.1 GT3. Although I love the 911's, I read someone once said, "The Cayman/Boxster is the car Porsche wants to build. The 911 is the car Porsche has to build."
My biggest fear with switching over to the 911 is that (besides the grip out of the corners) it'll feel bigger/heavier and more like a GT car than a track car. I'd love to have more experience on the track with a 911.
The Spyder/997.2 are the last of the 997 era- meaning the cars will more than likely be much more reliable in the long run than a 981 first year production car.
True. Although I would only keep the car for about 3-4 years as I am looking to get into a GT3/Turbo in the long run.
The Boxster S is nothing "special" either, the 911s wins by miles when it comes to being Special.
Yes, I did mention that. I will definitely have to say the Spyder would be special than the 911. Spyder>911-S>Boxster S.
The Spyder and 911 will have absolutely excellent resale values at this point. You need to be ready to take a bigger financial hit with the 981 Boxster S.
Very true. I'm keeping this in mind.
If this is your Only car and you need/want the updated nav and interior I can understand your desire for the 981.
My personal solution to this is having a daily driver with all the updated tech (BMW is much better than Porsche when it comes to nav and such) .
Yea, it'll be my only car. I don't care much for navi as I will always use my phone's Waze app. It alerts me when there's a cop as well as other things. I just want a nice, updated interior.
I still love my old 997.1 I've had for the past 5 years; the longest I have ever owned any vehicle. It is the most challenging car to learn as it is RR.
I've been to Muholland hwy countless times in my car in the past years and I feel that the last time I went up I was the fastest. The experience and learning to Fully utilize the RR platform is like no other . Most 911 owners sell their cars without ever exploring the limits.
You can hop into a Boxster or any 50/50 weight ratio car and rip turns like no other . Heck, every single BMW car for sale (I mean every single) is now 50/50 weight distribution.
I'm not talking down on the 987/981 platforms. I love them; Especially the Spyder. They handle on rails and are very confidence inspiring in the canyons . The 981 Cayman was just so easy to drive and so fast.
But there is an experience that Only the 911 can offer.
Let the 50 years talk for itself.
Hmm, I've enjoyed my Boxster S so much that I can only hope for the same thing, but slightly quicker+more grip. I've explored the limits of it during Auto-X with and without PSM. That's why I don't want so much of a change. Mid-Engine is debately the superior platform. I'd like to see a test comparing the GT4 with a 997.1 GT3. Although I love the 911's, I read someone once said, "The Cayman/Boxster is the car Porsche wants to build. The 911 is the car Porsche has to build."
My biggest fear with switching over to the 911 is that (besides the grip out of the corners) it'll feel bigger/heavier and more like a GT car than a track car. I'd love to have more experience on the track with a 911.
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If you like the mid engine and light weight feel, you are not going to get it on the 997. Sounds like you really like to drive top down. Personally, I am not a fan of the 911 cabriolets, just looks weird to me. But if you don't care about cabriolets, why don't you give the Cayman S a look? You are not going to buy until January, Boxster prices drop a lot in the winter. Last year, I saw several GTS sold for low 70's, so my guess is it'll be mid 60's by November this year. Boxster GTS times and 997.2 C2S times should be very close.
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If you like the mid engine and light weight feel, you are not going to get it on the 997. Sounds like you really like to drive top down. Personally, I am not a fan of the 911 cabriolets, just looks weird to me. But if you don't care about cabriolets, why don't you give the Cayman S a look? You are not going to buy until January, Boxster prices drop a lot in the winter. Last year, I saw several GTS sold for low 70's, so my guess is it'll be mid 60's by November this year. Boxster GTS times and 997.2 C2S times should be very close.
I was thinking Boxster prices would definitely drop in the winter. Does that go for Porsches in general since they're better suited for the summer? I love everything about the GTS. I think love the exterior, interior, and sound. I would love to have closer to 400hp though. The only problem is that price-wise it's right at 997.1 Turbo territory. I believe for what I'm looking for, tight responsive handling, visceral feel, responsive throttle the GTS suites me best. I will keep a close eye on the prices. Hopefully I get an invite to the Porsche World Roadshow again this summer so I can get a better feel of the GTS and a 911.
Again my ideal car is probably the new Boxster Spyder or a GT3 but it's more than I'd like to spend. But there's just something about a 911 Turbo!
After giving it even more thought and research I am now leaning towards a 911-S. I may even hold off until April/May and go with a 997.1 Turbo which is what I've always wanted to own next.
Last edited by MrNurse; Jul 8, 2015 at 09:10 AM.
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Unless the people you're thinking about to ride in the back seats still like Captain' Crunch, you can forget about it. There's not much headroom and teenagers will hate you, adults will sue you for cruel and unusual punishment. It's fun for small kids but my 8.5 year old daughters complain after a bit.
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I vote Boxster Spyder. Remove the "Boxster" badge and move "Spyder" to the middle of the decklid to remove any stigma of it being a "lesser" Porsche. Any non-Porsche owner won't know the difference; they'll be too busy drooling over its sexy lines, and you'll be too busy enjoying it to care! Something about a hardcore mid-engine roadster just ticks all the right boxes to me.
Then again, living in the Northeast really limits the amount of enjoyment you can get with a convertible, even moreso one with such a minimalist convertible top! The 911 C2S can be enjoyed 8 months out of the year if you don't care about getting salt on it, and a C4S or Turbo can be enjoyed year 'round if you're brave enough to drive it in the snow!
Then again, living in the Northeast really limits the amount of enjoyment you can get with a convertible, even moreso one with such a minimalist convertible top! The 911 C2S can be enjoyed 8 months out of the year if you don't care about getting salt on it, and a C4S or Turbo can be enjoyed year 'round if you're brave enough to drive it in the snow!
Last edited by CoreyC2S; Jul 10, 2015 at 08:16 AM.
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Surely I'm biased but I would get the 997 C2S hands down. Not even a second thought. A beautiful clutch/gearbox with hydraulic steering and enough power to keep you satisfied.
Not to mention, switching from the mid engine platform to rear during your HPDE's, will in turn make you a better and more experienced driver. I read your entire post and I find this to be a no brainer. Do it, you wont regret it!!
-John
Not to mention, switching from the mid engine platform to rear during your HPDE's, will in turn make you a better and more experienced driver. I read your entire post and I find this to be a no brainer. Do it, you wont regret it!!
-John
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Unless the people you're thinking about to ride in the back seats still like Captain' Crunch, you can forget about it. There's not much headroom and teenagers will hate you, adults will sue you for cruel and unusual punishment. It's fun for small kids but my 8.5 year old daughters complain after a bit.
I vote Boxster Spyder. Remove the "Boxster" badge and move "Spyder" to the middle of the decklid to remove any stigma of it being a "lesser" Porsche. Any non-Porsche owner won't know the difference; they'll be too busy drooling over its sexy lines, and you'll be too busy enjoying it to care! Something about a hardcore mid-engine roadster just ticks all the right boxes to me.
Then again, living in the Northeast really limits the amount of enjoyment you can get with a convertible, even moreso one with such a minimalist convertible top! The 911 C2S can be enjoyed 8 months out of the year if you don't care about getting salt on it, and a C4S or Turbo can be enjoyed year 'round if you're brave enough to drive it in the snow!
Then again, living in the Northeast really limits the amount of enjoyment you can get with a convertible, even moreso one with such a minimalist convertible top! The 911 C2S can be enjoyed 8 months out of the year if you don't care about getting salt on it, and a C4S or Turbo can be enjoyed year 'round if you're brave enough to drive it in the snow!
I'm leaning towards a Spyder or a 997 Turbo.
Surely I'm biased but I would get the 997 C2S hands down. Not even a second thought. A beautiful clutch/gearbox with hydraulic steering and enough power to keep you satisfied.
Not to mention, switching from the mid engine platform to rear during your HPDE's, will in turn make you a better and more experienced driver. I read your entire post and I find this to be a no brainer. Do it, you wont regret it!!
-John
Not to mention, switching from the mid engine platform to rear during your HPDE's, will in turn make you a better and more experienced driver. I read your entire post and I find this to be a no brainer. Do it, you wont regret it!!
-John
There's just so many Porsches to choose from and you can't go wrong with either!
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Best of luck with the Borla exhaust. I had one on my 997.1S cab. Beautiful sound -- from outside the car. Inside, the drone was unbearable. After an hour even MrNurse would need a nurse. Mine lasted a week on the car. Other than that, I don't think you can go wrong with any of your choices.
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Best of luck with the Borla exhaust. I had one on my 997.1S cab. Beautiful sound -- from outside the car. Inside, the drone was unbearable. After an hour even MrNurse would need a nurse. Mine lasted a week on the car. Other than that, I don't think you can go wrong with any of your choices.
I currently have a Fabspeed Race exhaust on my Boxster S. I was going to go with Borla but I wanted something louder plus the Fabspeed Race had the best weight savings. I would rather have no drone but I got use to it. My girlfriend/family/friends get use to it as well. If I go with a Spyder I'd get a Fabspeed race exhaust. If I go with a 981 (which is lower on my list), then I'd go with the Borla exhaust which has basically no drone. Im absolutely in love with the sound of it. It's as if they made the exhaust exactly to my liking. Even the PSE on the 981 is amazing.
I've read many reviews of the 981 Borla exhaust and ppl report no drone. Here's one example:
Second, my best guess is that the exhaust that was installed on my 981 is an ATAK system. The reason I believe this is so is because the model number designation (#140534) is consistent with other Borla ATAK systems. This is exciting because one of the biggest complaints about aftermarket cat-back exhausts for the 987 series was drone. With the exception of maybe one or two brands, virtually every system (including Borla) yielded resonant cabin drone in the 2000-3000 RPM range, especially under load. I know it was my biggest complaint of the prototype Borla XR-1 cat-back exhaust I had installed on my 2009 987.2 CS. I believe ATAK, with its custom acoustic tuning, has the ability to eliminate this drone on the 981 (more on this below).
DRONE. Here's the good news - there is NO drone. I drove the car in multiple conditions, including tooling around under 25mph in residential areas, 40mph on city streets, and up to 80mph on the freeway. The ONLY time I hear a tiny hint of drone is when I'm in 7th gear at about 70mph and I give the car a little more throttle to accelerate. Even then, the level of drone is virtually negligible and sounds almost exactly like the stock (non PSE) Porsche exhaust. I sincerely believe that this is because Borla R&D utilized their ATAK tech to tune the mufflers and eliminate drone, but a Borla rep would need to verify this.
DRONE. Here's the good news - there is NO drone. I drove the car in multiple conditions, including tooling around under 25mph in residential areas, 40mph on city streets, and up to 80mph on the freeway. The ONLY time I hear a tiny hint of drone is when I'm in 7th gear at about 70mph and I give the car a little more throttle to accelerate. Even then, the level of drone is virtually negligible and sounds almost exactly like the stock (non PSE) Porsche exhaust. I sincerely believe that this is because Borla R&D utilized their ATAK tech to tune the mufflers and eliminate drone, but a Borla rep would need to verify this.
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