I am going to try to add something of value here.......My 9 "only" has 450 horses and I have got to say it is more than enough to scare the crap out of me even when I am not doing anything other than accelerating in a straight line. My background has always involved speed......jet pilot, 30 plus muscle cars over the years, etc. I really think modern HP numbers are more about bragging rights as opposed to actual useful power. Perhaps I am just too old anymore to "get it" but I don't think my skills have degraded that terribly yet. I guess I'm a little more focused on self preservation!

 

McLaren 12C (616hp)
Ferrari F12 (730hp)
458 Speciale (597hp)

 

I agree 100%. However, the general buying public do care about numbers and want the best. How you define best varies but to most, it's numbers. It's why car mags post numbers as KPIs, the Nurburgring times exist, top gear test track, etc, etc.

If you are in the market for a Vanquish, you are in the same market as the FF and F12. If you put them side by side with a data sheet, there is no comparison. The Ferraris win in every category. If you put it against a Bentley Continental GT you have a cheaper car with comparable stats (I think the Bentley was faster around the top gear track but can't confirm) and better tech.

The Vantage is better positioned against Maserati Gran Turismo, Porsche 911 (all variants), and I'm sure others. The problem is its tech and transmission are not aging well and need an overhaul. The car did great in the past with sales but is falling off and falling behind. This can be salvaged if they go big here and produce a next gen Vantage that's in the 500hp mark base with better integrated tech and a DCT. I would also like to see them continue to offer a 6 speed or 7 speed manual option. It differentiates them. Last they need to keep the price point under 150k.

 

Okay, a V8 Vantage with 500 bhp, available with DCT or a manual, and costing below $150k. It's a nice dream, but it ain't gonna happen.

 

And old C6 Corvette Z06, ZR-1, Vipers for decades (traction control used to be a foreign concept, but now is able to apply power), Mustang GT500 (over 600HP), Camaros, etc...

 

I agree that if you can't use 500HP, what's the point? But I also believe that if a car manufacturer can't make 500HP work at the wheels - they need to go home and figure out how everybody else does it. The beauty of the age we are living in is the ability to APPLY that power to the ground - through engineering, tires, suspension, etc... we are able to transfer MORE power than ever from the engine to the road.

500HP is actually a good starting point - because cars that cost over $100K should have a higher standard in performance AND engineering.

 

It can happen if they leverage tech from outside companies such as Mercedes instead of investing in developing their own. They are so in the red that I feel they need to do something big to differentiate themselves and stand out. Putting an Aston below 150k with respectable numbers will bring it closer. Or I could be completely wrong and Aston is just like our gov't (USA) who can operate year over year on loans and debt

Excellent points!

 

Two things:
New Vantage at 500hp
New, class competitive auto tranny

Without those, I fear the worst. I just re-read the Top Gear Magazine special on the One77. The transmission was the only blemish on a car that should have zero. But the car also reminded me that Aston can develop a brilliant engine without a big producer. Shame that the most powerful NA engine was wasted on a limited production car and not rolled into production by now in order to secure bragging rights, at least for a while. But the upshot is that the engines aren't the main problem, shifting and design need to catch up.

 

These threads are rather amusing. On the Aston forums, people complain about a lack of power and modernization. On the Ferrari forums, people complain about too much unusable power and too much modernization.

Sounds like most of you want a Merc with a body kit. No thanks.

 

^^^Sorry, but expecting Aston to produce cars with power outputs that compare to its rivals and automated manual transmissions that don't require you to lift off the accelerator pedal when you up-shift is not unreasonable.

 

I'm a pretty frequent poster on Fchat and have never seen a thread complaining about too much power. Come to think of it, I don't believe I have seen a thread on any forum that complained about too much power...

 

Speaking of power and Ferrari, Jeremy Clarkson actually said on Top Gear that the F12 would be better if it didn't have so much power. Now that's a bombshell!

 

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/fer...e-ferrari.html

There are plenty of comments in that thread and other threads on Fchat about inability to access power safely or realistically.

Example from OP...

" I'm tired that the only way you can drive them with any sort of anger is on a track or you will be in jail for the weekend."

You're welcome.

 

He's just doing his job as an entertainer... and that perspective was referring to the F12 for legal street use only.

I have not experienced a problem of TOO much power. I still go flat out almost daily in my DD.

Regarding Aston - I see nothing wrong with taking that cookie-cutter engine, adding an outsourced DCT (similar to others), and starting there.

 

^^^If you saw the episode, he felt that the car was too nervous, to overeager for a GT. It wasn't an issue of the car being too fast to legally drive on the road.