Hi all,

As always- this forum has been incredibly insightful and helped me get set on a DB9 recently (I've been reading the forum for a lot longer and have kept an eye on the market for 7+ months).

I am flying to see and purchase a 2010 DB9 Volante that I am under agreement on this weekend. However, the seller messaged me yesterday and said that he pulled the car out of the garage and noticed a couple of areas of peeling on the back right side panel (pictures attached). He tried reaching out to a recently-visited mechanic and ceramic coating shop, but without any luck/ accountability from them, he himself offered to drop the price a few thousand.

Based on the pictures, it appears as if the clear coat is peeling/flaking. I am excited about buying the car- it seems to be in great mechanical condition and generally well-maintained, but want to wrap my head around this peeling a bit more. Given that Astons are notorious for some of the best paint jobs around the world, I am a bit surprised to see this. As a part of my due diligence, I will be getting a PPI done from a reputable independent shop (many AM dealerships stopped doing PPIs for some reason), but wanted to reach out to the community for your thoughts.

• Is this at all common in DB9s, or Astons in general?
• Anyone know what the cause of this might be?
• Anyone know if this will be covered by AM's 10-year corrosion warranty (I imagine they'll be somewhat difficult given the car is nearing 10-years)?
• If not, does anyone know how to fix/repair this, whether I should go to a reputable exotic body shop or the AM dealership?
• How much would it cost to fix this? I realize to re-paint the whole car, I'd probably be looking at ~$20k and that would hurt resale value drastically, but would that be my only option or could I potentially just get this area fixed?
• How much a partial fix-up impact resale value and are there any other things I should be on the lookout for since this happened (any water damage, corrosion elsewhere, anything mechanically, etc.)?

The seller seems like a stand up guy and a person who I'd want to buy from (I believe buying from the right seller is an important part of looking for the right car), as evidenced by his upfrontness and willingness to reduce the price himself upon realization.

Would appreciate any insight and thoughts! Look forward to being an active contributor once I've had the ownership experience under my belt!

Thanks,
sha001




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It's not clear from your description, does the car have a ceramic coating? If so, that could explain this. It's not unheard of for clear coat to flake, but on these cars I don't recall seeing it before. It does look like there's a significant adherence problem from the separation around the clear that has already flaked. Has the car been repainted?

 

Yes, the car does have a ceramic coating. Could it be the ceramic coating peeling? I'm pretty new to any kind of coating peeling, so would ceramic coating peeling be easier to fix than clear coating peeling? Do both of those spread and/or hurt the car's paint? What would be the possibility to repair and estimated costs?

To my knowledge, the car has not been repainted. I called the former dealerships and they both said the car was well-maintained. The current seller bought it from reputable used car dealer (not necessarily exotic dealer but they sell a bunch of exotics too), so I'm not sure if they sent it for servicing/got it washed at the wrong place...but I imagine that any impact of that would show up before the 3 years the current seller had it?...

 

I don't know that I'd put much into a dealer's assessment of "well maintained" or even what that means. It could very well be the ceramic coating didn't bond to the paint. It certainly looks like that to me. A bad ceramic job. I'd actually recommend getting it looked at by a body shop for an assessment. They would be able to tell easily. Is it easy to remove? No, not at all, but there may be ways to correct or minimize it. Someone else with more experience in them would need to chime in. The good news is that if it is the ceramic, at least the paint is unharmed.

 

Thank you for the insight. I will call the PPI shop to see if they do/can assess body work or if I should bring it to another shop as well. Do you or does anyone on this forum know how much it could cost to "correct/fix it" and/or "remove it". I really do hope it is a ceramic work without damage to the paint.

If it is the paint clear coating, would this be the type of thing covered under AM's 10-year corrosion warranty?

As for the dealer's comments, I agree to take them with a grain of salt. They did say that the previous sellers spared no expense when brought to their attention, so that was a bit comforting. In my experience, it's usually tougher to find how the earlier sellers' maintained it rather than the most recent sellers who may have their service records, so that has a somewhat added layer of comfort...that's all I was trying to say. Appreciate your insight, Blue2000s, and look forward to hearing any additional thoughts/comments!

 

The entire auto industry put it in the crapper about 2008 with "Green Paints". Water based, not solvent, and while it does reduce the VOx, they struggled to get it right. The re-work community was (is?) still allowed to use traditional 2K systems which bond better. Nothing surprises me when it comes to paint/coatings. I had Honda redo about 1/2 of a 2010 Odyssey that had it's paint job peel off.

 

walk away... why by a car with a known problem that can't be reconciled? take emotion out of your decision... what more about the finish you can't see or don't know about?

 

the type of person that owned the car previously is very important to me when purchasing a high-priced used item. if the damage was found and mentioned only AFTER it was clear that you were actually coming to view the car in person, i would walk away, even if it cost me the price of a deposit. that damage is very apparent and it seems to me that the vast majority of aston owners would know it was there before they ever decided to sell the car. caveat emptor.

i'm skeptical, but admittedly guessing, that that damage involves a ceramic coating. they are usually in the several micron thick range. and i've found no photos of ceramic coating adhesion failures that look even remotely like that. however, it DOES look like several pics i've seen of clear coat failure. of course if the price of the car is 20-25,000 less than market it may still be a good deal...

BTW, if the damage is on the same side, it may be the result of a scrape and poor bodywork.

 

Normal PPI’s do not include the evaluation of the bodywork, only mechanical. It looks however that the DB9 was in some mishap that required bodywork and repainting and they did not do a very good job. I have found that this can drastically effect the value and future resale of said vehicle.

I know purchasing a vehicle, especially an Aston, can be emotional but you must be prepared to walk away. I found an absolutely stunning Vantage with only 2100 miles that I traveled to see but both headlights were completely full of condensation. The vehicle would not pass inspection with the condensation and it was only a matter of time until the headlights would fail. Replacement of both headlights at $5400 each plus installation was $11,700. The seller refused to budge from his price and I walked.

It’s obviously your decision but I would personally not purchase this vehicle even if the seller came down $10K.

Your car is out there and you will eventually find it.

 

I have never seen clear coat peel off any Aston. This is either the ceramic peeling off or it was repainted. Aston will absolutely not warrant this; it isn’t corrosion.

 

I never would have left a deposit on anything until it passed a thorough PPI to my satisfaction and the contract reflected this. I certainly hope you did this. Having purchased countless high ticket items (aircraft, yachts, homes etc) this contractual understanding is paramount.

If the seller is truly honest and was totally unaware of the paint (and possibly other expensive issues) then he/she should be more than willing to refund your deposit. If not, and the paint issue was not disclosed prior to your deposit, you have the right to pursue legal action.

 

I'm no professional detailer but I have worked with ceramic coatings and I have never seen one do this. They are extremely thin and when they wear they do so by abrasion, not peeling AFAIK. This is either clear coat peeling, or paint protection film peeling (but you haven't mentioned any PPF so it is likely the former).

I would walk away.

 

Thank you for all the comments. To be clear, there is not a deposit at stake, and I do have the ability to walk away. The seller knew all along that I would be flying down, so it does appear that he did not know until he took the car out to take some additional detailed pictures at my request. He also mentioned it himself and reduced the price voluntarily, so it feels more genuine.

From what I'm gathering, most are indicating that it does not look like any other ceramic coating issue they've seen in the past. I do not think there is a PPF on it. So it must be a clear coat issue or a mishap combined with poor paint job/body work. I will triple check with the seller on the latter.

That said, the car is being offered at a pretty good discount to market (we had already negotiated quite a bit before this issue popped up and then he dropped a few thousand for this). Assuming the car passes mechanically in PPI, and everything else comes out clean, does anyone know what kind of repair costs I'm looking at if it is the clear coating?

IF it is the clear coating, would that be covered under AM's warranty?

IF it is clear coating and AM won't cover, do I need to repaint the whole car or is it possible to fix partially? Would that also impact value drastically?

I could obviously look at Edmunds, Cargurus, dealers, etc., but given that the range of a 2010 vehicle varies so much, what would forum members consider market price to be for a clean/well-maintained 2010 DB9 Volante with ~30k miles?

Thanks again for all the help! Trying to get my head around this a bit more before flying out this weekend.

 

Aston's are already at a low price, entry point. if you think at all about resale, body damage, repaints without full documentation of before and after, etc is like leprosy... good luck with decision

 

That is not a ceramic coating, it is clearly the clearcoat pealing. Given the size of the area, it also can't be new and my guess is that either guilt got the better of the seller or he was (rightfully) worried you'd take a swing at him for wasting your time and not disclosing something so obvious before you traveled to look at the car.

You should expect no warranty coverage for a paint defect like that. And you probably wouldn't need to paint the whole car assuming the rest of the paint is in good condition.

I would be thinking more like $10k off the fair market price because of the paint defects, plus any adjustment for other items a PPI finds. Not that it would cost you that much to get a couple of body panels repainted but it will take your time, you will be unable to use the car, it won't be original any more, etc, etc.

Paint work on a car is not necessarily something to be afraid of, my own car has been painted on. I have no idea why it was, the carfax was spotless, but it is nice work and knowing what to look for I could see it before I bought the car, so there were on surprises. The dealer, on the other hand, had no clue and told me told me that the car was previously owned by a meticulous fanatic (total BS).

It could make for a great deal on an amazing car, but if you are not completely clear about and comfortable with what you are getting yourself into with a repair like this then you should walk away and find yourself a car that doesn't need this level of fixing.

Good luck!