I don't doubt Drew, I was just asking to see things for myself. I don't like others to come to conclusions for me.

Regardless, this is simply really about getting to the bottom of questionable dyno results that were not supported with the video. It is very simple, it can and will be done, and I hope you man up and apologize to RPI for insulting their products for no reason.

 

Ya I'll apologize as soon as you do for calling me a liar and trying to tarnish my reputation for no reason based on someone elses race that had nothing to do with me or my car.Everyone with a RPI exhaust came here and called BS on the Gintani numbers on a whole because Brian lost a race and my name get's dragged in by you from left field even though I had nothing to with it. Of course I'm gonna bring RPI into it they probably created the rumor that Gintani screwed with the numbers. KiokenM3 Said a "bird told him" I wonder who that bird was it had to be someone working at RPI obviously. If it wasn't RPI thats cool but then who else would benefit by starting a rumor like that? I think He should bring that person that told him the rumor into the conversation. And they can make their statements with some sort of actual proof. The video of Brian losing to Drew proves nothing other then Brian lost a race not that ALL Gintani Dynos are fake including mine because then what if Drew post a video where I'm like a Half car in front of or behind him? Does that make my numbers fake too? And you still haven't answered how my results are fake if I got the same gains at another independent Dyno shop either.

Either way get to the bottom of the situation if you want go do your dyno test all over I don't care just leave my name out of it and stop calling me a Liar without some real good proof.

 

Oh, ya, you've had nothing to do with going pushing Gintani's numbers around on every board, right? You've had nothing to do with putting down RPI's products? You've had nothing to do with claiming your ride with the Gintani exhaust was quicker than RPI rides based simply on those dyno numbers?

I'm not saying the dyno is fake, I'm saying it is corrected. I'm also saying you are not gaining 70 wheel with bolt on's on a dyno dynamics. I don't know who told that guy what, I just know my results, yours, and everyone else's that has been posted thus far.

When we have the results from both on the same dyno same time, and they support what you claimed, I'll apologize to you. If they don't, you owe everyone a big *** apology.

 

that 996TT is fast

 

I'm never going to apologize that my car got the gains it did on 2 different dynos. It just is what it is all I can speak for is my own cars results. I posted my dynos everywhere because thats what enthusiast do to share info with others otherwise why bother post on any board? Am I not supposed to share my results? I could care less if Gintani sold more or less exhaust because of my post I like my exhaust and I got my tune and I just stated what happend there was no other motive. You keep saying my Dynos were corrected and you don't know that for sure you're assuming that based on a false rumor and a video that has nothing to do with me or my car.

 

No, I'm not assuming, I'm making a logical correlation based on my results, others results, this video, and the fact that you are not gaining 70-80 wheel with this motor with an exhaust, tune, and under drive pulley.

We are going in circles now, there is an elegant solution, which I have proposed for a while now.

 

Ya thats still in assumption. Either way it happend so deal with it just because RPI couldn't do it doesn't mean it's not doable. So if RPI can't make a Blower for the M3 that means the Gintani can't figure it out either right?

 

Come on, you should be capable of seeing what is wrong with your example.

It is a hypothesis at this point, supported by EVIDENCE.

 

Roflmao

For you trying to become an Attorney You've got alot to learn..

 

Well guy, since we make trash, according to you. Let me lay the challenge down right now. Get a hold of someone with the Gintani stuff, preferably niterider. We will be holding a dyno day at RPI facilty pretty soon. WE WILL DYNO HIS CAR FOR FREE AT THE EVENT AND EXPECT TO SEE THE 390.

 

Hey guys.

My name is Eloy with Race Precision and I want to clarify a few things. Please dont make this an RPi vs. Gintani thing. I have met Alex at Gintani and I think hes a stand up guy. I wanted to post on this thread because it was brought to my attention and I felt that I should make a few things clear. First of all, what some of our customers say does NOT represent RPi or Race Precision. You will always have customers who are loyal to one brand and might express their opinions or experiences different.....sometimes in a way that is uncalled for. As for the dyno numbers that were mentioned, a friend of mine did the M3 tune at Gintani and did tell me that they used correction factors which is normal for facilities that use Dyno Dynamics dynometers. The DD(Dyno Dynamics) dynos tend to read VERY low compared to the Dynojet, Mustang and other dynos, esp. inertia type ones. There are different reasons why they read lower but sometimes the explanations can get tiring and most DD shops will just add the 10-15% correction factor to show similar numbers to what it would be on a Dynojet. When a customer asked about the peak numbers, I asked if he wanted to dyno with no correction or with Dynojet corrections. When I explained the difference, that is when the "correction factor" issue became public. Its not or was never meant to be a rumor or anything in that nature. It was simply a casual conversation between me and a customer who asked about the number differences when the car was dynoed at the two different facilities. Please lets not make this into anything more than what it is. I also respectfully ask those who might have a problem with me or the RPi product line to contact and speak to me. We have always stood behind our products and our customers 100% although not all of our customers reflect us.

Jmoney, please understand the situation. Yes, I AM the one who told my customer that there were correction factors used. It has nothing to do with calling anyone's dyno BS. If our customer said that or told people that, it has nothing to do with me or our company. I just want to lay everything to rest here because rumors start when people say, this person said this, and that person said or heard this. Unfortunately this issue got this far. I was not aware that a thread like this existed. I will call Alex tomorrow to confirm this with him also. As for what was mentioned above, I have no problem putting the car on the dyno during our open house.

 

Sounds like it is the other way around... it is a small world, the same tuners at Gintani tuned my car, I know what is up

You should not have ran your mouth the way you did, your numbers were not higher, they were corrected.

The solution is to have niterider dyno at RPI and lets see if the 390 that was shown, will be repeated, and if the car will make 30 wheel more than a similarly equipped car with the RPI exhaust.

Let me just remind you of what you said on M3post: You did not gain 70 wheel, sorry to burst your bubble.

 

If so be Then how did all the M3's at Gintani all dyno within the same numbers as your M3's stock? Him being a tuner Should have brought it up if it was an issue don't you think? Because that would imply that his "Tune" didn't really didn't do anything now did it? And I don't see how it could have been anything other then SAE correction he was talking about since all there runs were done the same waywith the only change between the runs while he was tuning was the changes he made with his laptop in the cars ECU. I've sat and watched him tune more then one car so I'm sorry but thats just non-sense. I can believe he would bring up the SAE correction factor because he did talk about that before at Gintani. So if you're talking about another correction factor like sticky or you're saying that SAE runs 10-15% higher then Your uncorrected runs then somethings wrong with what was said. I personally don't know enough about the DD dyno other then the roller load was always the same I believe it was set at 100 and the correction was always set to SAE. Other then that I have no idea how they can make changes to correction factors infront of my face without me knowing between runs. So even IF the correction factor that you're talking about was 10-15% higher then I'm sure my stock baseline would have showed that as well as everyone elses.

 

Im not here to explain to you what the differences between the dynos are. Powerchip did the tunes at Gintani and they also worked on a tune with us. I have no problems dynoing your car for free. If you want, you can go to Gintani, dyno your car and then come over to our place and see what the differences are. Also, we do dyno differently than other places. Many of you who have watched us R&D also know that. We will run the cars 10-15 times without cooldowns periods. The constant bashing is merely a situation of "not knowing" wtf is really going on. Im not even talking about SAE or other type of factors like some of you might be thinking about. There are a few things that can change the reading on a dyno dynamics dyno session. First, there is the temperature, humidity, pressure, etc that has to be entered in the bar screen of the Dyno Dynamics software. Once that is done, you have an IAT sensor that needs to be placed where the engine air source is. Then you have your drivetrain inertia setting. On an NA car, to ensure accuracy, we do a run to 3500rpm ramping "up". This means the dyno motor will ramp the load upwards while you have the car at full throttle. At 3500rpm, it will ramp it down bring the rpms back down to 1500rpm (while the throttle is still at full). We then look at the lines (both ramp up and down) to see if they stack on top of each other. If the graph is not the same, that means the inertia load is incorrect. Once the inertia load is corrected, you have the correction ratio which comes up when you hit the "x" key in the bar screen. Dyno Dynamics recommends .17 correction or about 17% correction for dynojet numbers. Your tire pressure, etc can also affect the numbers. When comparing one M3 to another, esp ones with different wheels/tires, you NEED to do the ramp test to ensure the numbers are accurate. This is why I tell customers not to go by the bar screen numbers when I start my dyno sessions. I usually do a few runs to set everything up before the actual samples.

Lasty, I have no problems with explaining how and why our systems work. This is not to say that others dont. Our M3 exhaust as well as all of our GT series exhaust systems is designed with the concept of maintaining the highest exhaust gas velocity possible. I design all of our exhaust systems so its important that we are able to explain to our customers why the stuff is made the way it is. The stock muffler has a lot of components that maintain a level sound and control the natural raspiness of that engine. This allows the car to have a decent sound but hurts the performance potential. We started by removing the front cat. CAts are not very effective until they reach a certain temperature so we knew that the front pipes got nice and hot. With a straight pipe we merged the two sides with a merge/balance chamber in the midpipe. This allowed us to maintain velocity while balancing out the exhaust from both sides. The reason we did do a true X design was because of the angle that the pipes came together. Going with a slight merge and about 6" of merge, we were able to keep that exhaust moving pretty quickly. From the beginning, we knew we wanted a straight through design for the muffler. This allowed us to save weight and space. The problem with straight through designs is that it can drone pretty bad. For this reason, we inserted a chamber at the front side of the muffler, enlarged the muffler from our original design about 10% and had the piping come in from the corner. This creates a slight redirection for the exhaust gas and drasticly helps with the drone. I understand the look might not be for everyone. I also understand how happy you are with the Gintani system, as you should be. They use a very nice muffler and the system is put together nicely.

 

Are you aware that Gintani uses a newer AWD Dyno Dynamics Model (450DS AWD) with a newer software version then yours? Therefore some of these steps you take may not even be nesscessary on their dyno? I'm just asking. Either way Brian would love to bring his car in but its currently getting the Gintani Supercharger installed. So its already been torn down as of yesterday. You can send mr sticky to Gintani if you'd like... Or wait for the next Beast Gintani builds. When I get My car back I'll Dyno at Gintani and come straight to you for another right after just to see the difference.