No idea. The paperwork just says that they topped it off. Same with the coolant.

 

gnat,
Thanks for posting this procedure. My dealer uses the drain plug method fortunately. I got sucked into the Porsche Maintenance plan for three years which gives a slight discount compared to the single purchase price of OC.
I bought a VW dipstick which requires minor trimming of the handle to clear the engine cover. Now if I can only get the dealer tech to use it to save time.

Here is the dipstick P/N I used:

http://www.planet-9.com/gallery/show...?i=35671&c=689

Here is a shot showing the trimmed dipstick in place:

http://www.planet-9.com/gallery/show...?i=35672&c=683

My dealer uses a metal vacuum canister to suck up the water from the bottom of the fuel filter housing. I had asked them to tell me how much water came out but with this tool they can't.

Rob

 

My fuel filter drain/replace DIY shows the VAG drain tool and gives its P/N, but any suction device that can reach the bottom of the housing will do.

I've drained water twice now and there was no appreciable water either time. This doesn't surprise me though for two reasons. The first is that the fuel is much cleaner now than it used to be, though less clean stuff is still available and you just never know. The second is the screwed up system/procedure Porsche has.

Diesel floats on water, so the water will collect at the bottom of the housing. The T-Reg and Q7 have a drain at the bottom of the housing that you just open until you get fuel. Porsche doesn't and the filter has to be removed, but as soon as you do the two liquids get mixed again. So unless you let it sit for a few hours after removing the filter or drain the entire housing, you actually aren't going to get significant water out

 

gnat,
Would the Toureg or Q7 filter fit in the Cayenne? I would be up for that upgrade since it would make things so much easier over the life of the car.

I'm used to taking care of my boat diesel which has a drain.

 

Rob, unlike the oil filter they use the same fuel filter, it's the housing that is different. I have no idea if you could swap them, but I believe they are in different locations too which could complicate such a swap.

I'm sure they had a good reason, but it sure ended up being a stupid design in my opinion. On top of the drain issues, it's also sitting right around and over things that really don't take kindly to getting covered in diesel fuel...

 

Can someone please double check the oil drain plug torque recommendation above? It says 22 or 23nm. But I have seen others say it should be more like 22 or 23 ft-lbs.

Thanks.

b-man

 

Sorry for the late reply, I don't logon here at work and forget to check at night...

It doesn't say 22 or 23nm. It says 22nm. The reference to 23 was from the linked post about how i initially derived the 23nm value as my dealer refused to give me the spec.

The actual value as taken from the listed PIWIS document is 22nm. That is the spec directly from Porsche.

 

I think they are actually the same filter, but with different part numbers. I do know that the aftermarket Mahle oil filter I bought was spec'd for both cars, even though the reference showed different OEM part numbers for them.

Anyway, just did the oil change myself for the first time. Took about 40 minutes total. I found with the air supsension on offroad high level and 2" ramps, I didn't even need to jack the truck up to get under.

I would like a fomoto though.

 

great tip!

 

Just for others that may be looking for the same information, I did some more research on the drain plug torque and size.

I ended up tightening my drain plug to 22 ft-lbs (not 22 nm). This is for my 2016 Cayenne Diesel (3.0 V6).

The main reason is that from what I saw, the same engine in a VW has a drain plug which is size M14x1.5 (just like my CD, which I measured to confirm). The VW drain plug is supposed to be tightened to "30 nm" (which is 22 ft-lbs).

22 ft-lbs also seems to make sense for the size and material.

b-man

 

You have over tightened your drain plug and I hope no one takes your "advice" here.

The 22nm value was taken directly from PIWIS/TSI which means it is the official spec from Porsche. 22nm is roughly 16 ft-lbs which means you've torqued it to almost half again the spec at roughly 30nm.

While they are the same basic motor there are some differences, including the oil pan and oil filter. While in many cases the values and procedures are probably the same, it is not safe to assume. A Porsche Tech or PIWIS/TSI should be consulted for the proper procedures and are the only valid source of record.

Not only have your risked damaging your oil pan, you've also given PCNA a foothold to deny warranty service on the motor if they discovered it (e.g. they can show you did not follow the approved procedures). In all likelihood you aren't going to have either issue, but it's not worth the risk when the correct information is available.

I had to guess at my first attempt as no one had yet documented it, I didn't know I could get access to PIWIS, and my dealer flat lied to me (claiming no spec existed). Even still my derived value was only 1nm (0.7 ft-lb) over the spec.

 

gnat, with all due respect, I have noticed numerous mistakes in Porsche technical literature for this vehicle. I do not want to argue with you. I have read many of your posts (here and on other forums). They are very informative and I appreciate you taking the time to post particularly because there is so little owner information out there for our vehicles. So I want to put this information out there. Others can chose to follow or ignore it.

I have worked on cars and other mechanical objects with threaded fasteners for a long time. The 22 nm (~16 ft-lbs) you quoted seemed too low. That's why I looked into this more.

From what I can tell, this drain plug and oil pan are the same as the *recent* VW Touaregs and Audis that have the same 3.0 Diesel V6 engine. I saw 22 ft-lbs quoted for these, which makes more sense than 22 nm. Even if our oil drain plug and pan are different, I went through the following thought process.

1) The threads on my 2016 Cayenne Diesel oil drain plug are size M14x1.5 with a 6mm internal hex. I measured all of this.

2) The oil drain plug is steel (male drain plug) going into steel (female oil pan/threaded boss). Although I have heard someone mention aluminum oil pans, I tested my parts with a magnet and they are steel.

3) The threads are obviously lubricated (because of the engine oil which runs onto the female threads).

22 ft-lbs seems about right, and it is within the safe range for torque for this application. So that is what I used.

If you or anyone else has any thoughts or basis for a different torque (other than what Porsche currently has listed), I would be happy to hear it.

b-man

 

I don't disagree with that assessment actually, but as long as the car is under warranty (which they are for even longer now) what they say is the only thing that matters. Doing anything else runs the risk of fouling up warranty claims.

The motor is actually the same going back for awhile. The plug and crush washers are indeed the same part. Maybe something changed in the 958.2, but the 958.1 has a different pan compared to the same vintage Q7 and T-Reg.

You've seen their official document (e.g. the PIWIS/TSI equiv) or someone has just repeated it? I'm not directly impugning your source, just pointing out that if it you didn't see the official document first hand it could be anything from a misunderstanding (nm vs ft-lbs) to a "random" guess.

I specifically quoted my document source expressly so others could check for themselves rather than take my word for it.

Maybe a change for the 958.2? Mine is definitely non-ferrous.

If yours is steel then it could very well be that the higher torque is correct. Someone should pull up the "WM 1001IN Tightening torques for engine" document in PIWIS/TSI for a .2 VIN and see if it changed. The latest update still says 22nm for the .1 though.

In your deduction of your value did you try determining the current torque value when you removed the plug for the first time as I documented in the thread where I came up with 23nm originally? That would have told you which value was actually correct.

 

That's a great question, and I had the same concern about someone guessing nm versus ft-lbs. At the moment, I can't recall where I saw the higher torque value. But I saw it multiple places (and at least one of them must have been reasonably credible). So I started to think the higher # could be correct. That being said, I like to always take a step back and do a common sense check (independently think these things through). The higher # made more sense to me.


Interesting. That might be the key difference. I am 100% sure the drain plug I removed (which came with the vehicle new from the factory) was magnetic steel. I am also 100% sure the new one I got with my oil filter (from forum sponsor Suncoast Porsche) and installed was also magnetic steel, and both drain plugs looked identical. There was also an aluminum washer with the original drain plug and new one.


Yes, I did do that and I remember it took a surprisingly high amount of torque to loosen it. At the moment I can't remember exactly how much. I *think* I used a torque wrench at 16 ft-lbs, then 22 ft-lbs, and then kept adjusting it higher until it broke free at significantly more than 22 ft-lbs.

But, I remember thinking it's just one data point because I can imagine the plug could have been tightened *dry* at the factory, then the pan attached to the bottom of the engine, then filled with oil. So that could have made the plug slightly "stuck."

b-man

 

Ah. Maybe some confusion. I was referring to my pan, not the plug. I can't say what my plug is (though I would guess steel as it is too heavy for Aluminum). I just reuse my factory plug with only the crush washer getting replaced.

Interesting. I don't remember what I started at, but I adjusted incrementally and when I got to 23nm mine came right open. Sounds like your's was definitely tighter than that.

If you don't mind, PM me your VIN and I'll refill my PIWIS account and pull the document specific to your car and see what it says. I'm really curious now and it would be good to update my document accordingly if the value differs for yours.