Supercharged M3 vs new 991 C2S:

These are my first impressions coming from a supercharged M3 (ESS 625, 4.10 gears, and full exhaust) to a (stock for now) 991 C2S.

It's very, very unfair, way too early, and contains very little technical facts, and mostly highly opinionated observations. These are my honest feelings about the switch, the cars, and I welcome questions and haters.

I've been wanting a 911 for a long time, and this March I finally pulled the trigger. What started out as "testing the waters" on facebook regarding the possibility of parting out my car, turned into selling everything within 20 minutes. I believe I hold the record in the fastest part-out in history of mankind. 2 days later the car was picked up by iND, and I said my goodbyes.

So before people yell at me about callously tearing apart the beast, and destroying a labor of love, please know that ALL parts found homes in friends cars and people I really like. So the beast lives on in about 5 other cars. Also, I really wanted the 911.

Lets start with the appearance and size of the cars:

Before I get into it.... I *did* look into getting a 997.2 GT3 and a GTS, but in the end my OCD prevented me from getting a used car, it might not make sense to most people, but other peoples OCD hardly make sense to others. I also decided it would be better to get the new chassis than the one that is 8 years old.

The 991 sitting next to the 997.2 looks huge! It appears like a Diet Panamera (or Panamera light for our European viewers). Same with the interior, gone is the intimate, spartan feel of the 997.2, and has been replaced with a more spacious, luxurious cabin. I'm conflicted about that, but I started to enjoy the creature comforts.

Now, when compared to the M3 (this is why we are here after all), the 991 is a tiny (light) car, so all is well in regards to size (that's what she said) and weight.

Coming from the supercharged M3 the 400 horsepower 911 feels slow, there is no push in the seats, no drama, very refined, gradual, and clinical.

My ESS M3 unleashed hell, and pulled like an angry pit bull with rabies. Wheel spin in every gear but 6th, many times it involves screaming equally induced by terror and delight. I always ended every trip soaking wet.... mostly sweat.

Initial impressions:

So when I drove the 911 off the dealer's lot I was underwhelmed... although I was giddy sitting in my own 911, I instantly realized that this is (compared to the beast) a fast luxury GT. And... I was conflicted right away. I was also slightly annoyed with the fact that my 9 year old daughter started to play with all the f@ckign buttons on the dashboard.

Here is the unfair part... I'm still in my break-in phase, and I have to keep it below 4200 rpm for 2000 miles (please lets not discuss the "need" for the break-in period). Similar to the S65 the engine in the 911 needs to be pushed to extract power, so that's why I call it a very early and unfair comparison.

On the drive home I started to really appreciate the cabin and the fit and finish, there is no question that this is a step above the M3. I actually really like the fact that everything has a button, for somebody who is borderline retarded (me) it is way easier than f@ckign around with the iDrive. It also looks way cooler, because more buttons is just better - don't even argue with me. What *does* suck is the Bose sound system and the controls for that, not a huge deal, but I'm convinced that Porsche let the intern design that part; more on that later.

Handling:

So I did a couple (semi) high-speed (around 120mph) runs, and felt that the 991 was a little busy. My M3 with KW V3's felt way more planted and stable. Again, a little unfair to compare stock to modded, but since we are talking about a 911 I was very surprised.

The good news is that I wasn't bothered by the electric steering at all. I can't tell the f@ckign difference. It's less busy, since it absorbs the bumps and road surface more (I guess), but it is just as precise as the M3 steering, but definitely not better (let's use this here: IMHO).

The handling improves when you take her to the curves, this is where the 911 shines, but it still won't outperform the M3.... the nose is light, and although you have a wider track now (over the 997.2) it still feels a little jittery when tuning in. I'm pretty sure you get used to that quickly though. But once in the corner you can hammer it, and slingshot your way out of the curve - very impressive, and this is something the M3 can't do that well.

But speeding around the backroads makes you realize that the 911 still has the engine in the wrong place (well, I love, but lets be honest). It is **** heavy, and you feel it. It moves its *** like Marilyn Monroe, and I love it! Despite all the electronic nannies you'll always be able to feel it, and it puts a big smile to my face. That was the first time I realized I didn't regret my switch.

Speed and Power:

Well, there is simply no comparison. The ESS M3 is a super-car eating monster, and the 911 is just a fast car. My beast ate everything... GT-R's, 458's, Lambos, it simply didn't matter. The 911 is a refined gentleman racer compared to the angry, drunk soccer hooligan that is running at you like a pack of skinheads with baseball bats.

So basically so far I think the 991C2S is a little underpowered. And I'm pretty sure I won't really change my mind even after playing with the higher rpm power-band. I'm not disappointed by it, but definitely something that I will address, probably with the optional power kit and a full exhaust.

Stance and Suspension:

Car needs a drop and Porsche's PSAM suspension is underwhelming. Granted, it hasn't been really track tested obviously, but I think we can do better.

Sport Exhaust and Chrono Package:

This, I really f@ckign love! Exhaust note from the optional sport exhaust is pretty awesome (still needs to be a louder of course), but for a stock exhaust it sounds fantastic. The pops and burbles are great! Lift off, and the engine is pooping popcorn in the exhaust.

The chrono packed gives you a fancy clock/stopwatch I will never use, but it looks business. And the g-force meter is great to mention while bragging over beers in a pub. Same goes for the gear shift indicator... I already have one, it's called the rev-counter. But the rev-match function is simply awesome, and very obnoxious during city driving, which obviously appeals to me greatly. This will be a great little feature for the track, can't wait to play with it in the high revs.

Haters:

This is fairly interesting. I got tons of attention in both cars, and people took and take cellphone photos all the time. The Beast got smiles from old and young, folks would cheer when I ripped it, and even my local cops gave me thumps up. it was a f@ckign crowd pleaser. No one tried to race me, and people waved me in during high traffic.

Driving a highly modded M3 makes you a local "hero", driving a new 911 makes you a ******-bag. The only folks that smile at you (and don't judge) are kids, and teenage girls... they love it, the rest... doesn't. It doesn't bother me, but filling up the gas tank is very different in the 911 than the modded M3. This is what I think the thought process is... for the M3: "I wonder what is under the hood?", the 911: "I wonder what this ******* does for a living?"

Engine bay:

Supercharged M3 = awesome!

991 = that's it?

Conclusion:

Now, if I gave you the impression that I'm unhappy with my purchase you'd be wrong, I love the 911, and I can't wait to drive it to iND!

But it is such a different animal than the monster I gave away, and I think when I'm old and crap my pants, I might not remember that 991, but I will always remember (senile or not) the Beast.

I will update this thread with photos, and more impressions as I explore the 911, and more importantly.... when I start modding it.

Thanks for reading.

Best,
Philip

Next, my review of the clutch and 7MT, and my thoughts after the first 1000 miles.

 

Great read!
I agree with other people's conceptions. Maybe it's all in my head, but I really do feel that whenever I fill up..

Would love to see pics of the beast!

 

1. Break in S so you can drive above 4200 which is where all the power is. 2. Line up standing start with M3, take revs to 6500 and drop clutch. If your M3 is on street tires, the S will leave it to least until 80mph because 700 hp M3s don't hook up. FYI: highway pulls are lame. 3. If friends think a modded M3 is cooler than a 911, get new friends. 4. Take to road course and drive both for an hour. Odds are the M3 will break. My last M3 was an E92 and stock vs stock they aren't remotely close.

 

I may be wrong, but I get the feeling that the OP bought the wrong car. I think he would love a modded GTR - like the Alpha 12 I got to drive. Talk about needing brown underwear.

 

I think you somewhat misread my comparison. It is obviously a somewhat unfair review, hence me calling it initial impressions.

These are my thoughts and initial impressions, it won't universally translate to anybody else. This is not an objective 'magazine" review, but personal feedback.

A properly set-up 700 hp M3 will eat anything from the line (or dig). Obviously, that can be said to pretty much every car, since you can mod anything to beat 'x'.

But I agree, stock vs. stock the 911 will win every time.

No, I didn't bought the wrong car, I absolutely adore the 991! I've driven plenty of AMS GT-R's and I had no interest in buying one. I was ready to move into a different animal all together. The 911 has a steeper learning curve than the M3, but overall is much more rewarding. I'm very happy with my purchase, don't confuse an honest look comparing my previous ride with the new one, with me being disappointed.

Thanks!

 

Your 991 is a grown-up's car....

IMO M3's are German rice magnets for the "3 beep" crowd. The owner base confirms.

 

I don't know what that means....

 

Nice write-up, would love to hear your thoughts after you break in and run her in sport+ on a track, which I did for the first time last Friday. It's like a different car...still no torque beast, but damn impressive. It actually made me think twice about getting a 991 GT3 next year...

 

Most race engines are not torque monsters, and that's totally fine with me.

My thoughts on the 7MT:

I love it, but I really think the 7th gear is unnecessary in the US. It kinda makes sense for the Autobahn once you reach your "cursing" speed, but I don't think it will see much action in my driving.

When I first drove off the lot I was rolling my eyes at the electronic gear indicator within the ref-counter, but boy am I glad I have that feature. The gears are so close together, and with the additional 7th gear I found myself (almost) selecting the wrong gear all the time at first. The indicator is a nice way to avoid a little money shift, although it only takes a couple of days and you get used to the gears and shifter anyway.

The clutch feels much better than the clutch (and clutch travel) in my M3.... very firm and not like the 'wizard's sleeve' feeling I was used to. Probably like the difference between banging an 18 year old and an 80 year old (hooker). I'm not proud of that reference, but I think it gets the point across. Having said that, clutch travel in other M3's I drove felt much better than my old M3.

The shifter of the 911 is awesome (once you get used to the extra "silly" gear)! Shifts are very accurate and short and precise (unlike my personal equipment which is large and sloppy).

So in conclusion the stick shift in the 991 is on par with the 6MT in the 997.2, and definitely better than the 6MT in the current M3.

Now lets look at a huge f@ck up of the 991 - the reflection of the dashboard in the windshield. Are you kidding me?!

Seriously, they spent millions in R&D and nobody realized that reflection? It is so ridiculously distracting that I had to buy new polarized sunglasses to deal with it, that's just pants-on-head retarded!

It's obviously not something you can ***** about when you hang out with friends who don't drive cars like us, since they will punch you in the dick, and they'd be totally within their right to do so. Also, don't complain about the long break-in period of a 911, you don't get much sympathy either.
__________________

 

Keep going, you will eventually get to the other car that is in there, beyond the drag racer and the GT car. It is not an M3 hot rod however, it is made for another purpose. If you like that purpose, there is no substitute.

 

Totally agree, and I'm thoroughly enjoying myself.

 

Are you talking about the IND in Palatine IL? the BMW tuner?

 

Yes, iND worked on the M3, and I'm ordering my mods from them again, the install will happen at the Porsche specialist 'Perfect Power' who are close by.

 

Cool. Yeah, I was there about 1.5 months ago to get the H&R springs installed on my C2S. Anthony is a great guy. Top quality and great price. Many of my friends also had their BMW mod there. I asked because I thought you are in New York.
Never been to Perfect Power before.
What are you ordering from IND? Anthony told me one of his friend is having his 991 C2S completely moded there. Wouldn't happen to be you, would it?

Nevermind, I take it back. I have talked to Perfect Power before. Seem like a nice shop, too.

 

My experience with 2 e46s and an E92 is the M3 doesn't have enough tire to hook up. Some guys with stock M3s and slicks do pretty well but with 500+ hp they just spin. Take it to a strip and watch what happens. Crazy trap speed though.