I can't believe we're debating the same topic with each side saying the same thing over and over again.

 

If I wait my 50's to get a Porsche, i better die

 

The debate seems to have moved to the question of whether the speed advantage of PDK is as large as most people think.

I hope we've moved past the 'debate' of which one is subjectively more enjoyable - to each his own on that. But I don't mind PDK guys telling MT guys "hey, you should really check this out, this PDK is way more fun than an ordinary automatic transmission." My experience with PDK so far makes me want to stick with manual in sports cars, but I can see why some people might enjoy PDK. I have a good automatic with paddles in the C63 (pretty aggressive shifting with nice blipping in sport mode), and it does have its pleasure.

 

This thread needs to end.. I am trying to focus over here!

 

If the GT3 becomes available with PDK I will buy it, otherwise I will not.

I am very happy to read about this potential development!

 

Question.. who here who is truly a track rat or hard core driver would turn Down a sequential box??
Porsche seems to think its the fastest way around the track would you not agree? Ie 997 cup cars.. I have driven with them, lap After lap they pull away just do to the speed of the shift.. I understand the difference between dog box sequential and dual clutch Pdk .. But this may be the way technology is moving..

 

Another factor to consider. A lot of Porsches are bought off the lot rather than ordered (I don't know the percentages). Sometimes people will be willing to buy a particular car on the lot, except that it doesn't have the transmission they want. By eventually taking away that choice and offering only PDK, maybe that would help sales? If other manufacturers are phasing out manual too, it would be easier for Porsche to go in that direction, since it means less risk of people leaving the Porsche brand just because manual isn't offered.

 

Or conversely they now know they are the only manual option and anyone who wants this tranny will come to them. Remember we are really only talking about 2-3 major brands left that offer high performance manual transmission cars.

 

True - I hope you're right.

 

The irony is absolutely astonishing...

I have so many threads I'll have to dig up...

So many quotes...

So many...

(Where is that internet popcorn)

 

Please explain the irony part. My curiosity is piqued.

 

I've participated in and spectated countless discussions about how Porsche is superior to Nissan (GT-R) because of the ability to choose between manual and DCT. The Porsche faithful have continuously stated that Porsche is a different company because they listen to their customers, and will always provide them with what they want, despite reasoning that they are a company out to make money.

I've posted in many PDK vs 6spd (7spd) threads where this has been discussed. Ferrari is moving away from it. Being the trend-setter, people stood back and watched them hit their sales mark, once again. I'm sure they've watched the GT-R - which is still hitting their mark, every year. Engineering becomes easier with less choice, and better to engineer a specific car for weight balance, due to the difference in weight/placement of the different gearboxes.

This is logical. It is why we have buttons for our windows, and a button (or key) to start the cranking motion of the engine, instead of winding it up ourselves.

It is the perfect blend of auto vs manual. Will there be some that prefer one way over the other? Of course. Will it hurt their sales enough to regret it? Nope. Move on.

Nissan has lost a sale or two, based on their unwillingness to offer a choice. But that has not stopped selling. And every GT-R performs identically, almost regardless of driver/monkey behind the wheel (in a straight line). Same with the 911 Turbo S. Figures are figures, and for the first time in history, driver 'x' can finally match the ACTUAL numbers that the factory drivers can reach.

Of course we all want choice. We all want a car tailored for us; unique. This is not as profitable. I predicted Porsche making this move 4 years ago (I've posted right here on 6speed), and was shot down by just about everybody.

The 458 is DCT only (among other Ferrari models)
THEN - the Turbo S is released in PDK only.
Then - rumors about the next Turbo being PDK only (not just the 'S').
Now the GT3, once coveted as the 'drivers' car, is now rumored (and possibly) to only be offered with a single transmission.

I've stuck by it, and was continuously put down because Porsche is 'not that kind of company' - they aren't Nissan or Ferrari. They are better than that. They are Porsche.

However, this move makes business sense. From a performance standpoint, as well as sales. Someone remind me what Porsche is? A business that built its name based on performance.

 

Depends on how u define track rat or hard core driver.

I just do DE's but my greatest satisfaction on the track has been ability to learn to heel toe properly. I thought long and hard about switching to a PDK car but I wanted to learn this technique and I am happy I did. (Not happy it took nearly 3 years!!!!)


Now in becoming a better driver there are so many other areas to concentrate on, smooth brake to throttle application, when to brake, how quickly to take your foot off the brake, where to turn, and a zillion other things that PDK is no longer on the radar for me.

But I don't race for fun or profit and I guess if I did I guess my outlook would be different.

 

Thanks, understood.

I don't know all the specifics, but hasn't Porsche's ownership changed to now being majority owned by VW? If it's no longer a 'family business', I can see that priorities will change. Shareholders in large companies are primarily interested in return in investment, and sometimes only short-term. A sad thing, but that's what happens when it's all about the money.

The issue is somewhat personal for me because I've deliberately limited the growth of my own engineering firm over the years because I've wanted to maintain our focus on engineering excellence rather than just viewing it as a vehicle to make money. My bank account may not be as large because of that, but I have no regrets.

 

VW does own majority but Porsche specifically retained control o the company in the deal. With that said, is that really what's going on? I don't know. But don't forget the big wig at VW is actually a Porsche family member and has a deep love for Porsche and wants the company to be the best possible. Making Porsche as profitable as possible has been a great boon for 911 lovers. The money made on mainstream products has given us an endless array of 911s to choose from. Whose to say that Porsche isn't working on another 911 that will be somewhere between the gt3 and the gt2. The new gt3 is already going to lose some of its raw edge because of how refined the 991 is. Perhaps Porsche has something up their sleeve? Perhaps not. This is all speculation and rumors so no need to stroke out just get. I'm sure if you really want a GT3 with a manual when it's not offered Porsche will custom make it for enough money. Lamborghini fitted a Murcielago with an auto for his wife. So I'm sure would do the opposite for you