i agree 100% with op, also, no porsche should ever have less hp than a cts v, and i'm writing to mr porsche immediately

 

You can't even compare the BMW to the 911. Not even in the same league. If HP is all that matters to you, go buy an american muscle car and keep the 991.

 

please sell the 991 and move on....you missed the boat

 

I don't have a BMW dealer nor am I a BMW "operative". I have owned every variant of 911 dating back to 1988 and enjoyed them all. I like my 991. In my opinion, they should have left the base car at 3.6 litres and given it 385hp minimum. A 5hp bump is a pittance for a complete redesign. It would still be less than an M4 but I would tend to gripe less because it's a significant improvement from the 997. I guess my real messge was not necessarily for Porsche to offer more HP than the M4 and more along the lines of stop being so stingy about HP increases across the 911 line.

 

The M3 has had more HP then 911s for a long time, its nothing new.

 

then why are you posting this to an internet forum? Call Porsche and tell them and then go trade "up" to an M4.

 

no luck there, I made a poll about M4 vs 991 on Bimmerpost when I was making my decision. They voted for the 991.

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=870855

 

I am not a Porsche engineer, nor have I asked one about this, but I believe that the design brief included increasing efficiency across the 911 range. I also believe the global regulatory environment will continue to put pressure on manufacturers in this area. Do I believe that Porsche could have released the 991 with more powerful engines? Sure. But, they must balance today's content with tomorrow's requirements (reduced emissions, ability to offer upgrades later....)

There's an underlying thread of "value" to this thread. P-cars certainly don't stand at the low end of the cost curve, and it's an individual judgment about whether they provide commensurate benefit. All I can say is: I'm keepin' mine.

 

I have owned 5 M3's over the years and I can say that I would rather have the 3.4 Carrera over the M3 if a sports car is what I wanted. That being said, I do not think I would ever spend 95K+ for a base Carrera with the 3.4 liter engine. I am not trying to offend anyone here that has a base model Carrera, but for me, that is just too much to pay for that little power. I know you could argue that it is a better "value" than the S, but for me, there is a minimum amount of power and torque I have to get before I plop down the cash.

 

I've had 3 M3's, since I was 19 e36 at 16- e46 at 21 and the e92 at 27, had lots of track days in all of them, for me the e46 was unique, didn't love the e92 but kept it for 5 years then I sold it in January for a 991 C2S. There is no comparison between these cars, although M3 drivers think so, I got smoked by a measley 380hp 997.2 C2S, driving the V8 M3 on a straight line, on a track it would have been destroyed, the 991 is so much better than the e92, I left one in the dust, and at a track another whole league, the M4 is the size of a e39, it would need more than 100 hp to keep up with the 991, we are all car fans, the M4 is great , but it is no Porsche inside or outside, I'll never go back to M, it's not about hp, tq, it's how ghe whole package feels, and the 991 just feels perfect

 

You do not measure the performance increase of a Porsche based on hp:



I have driven E36,E46 and E92 M3's and loved them too. They are simply different cars for a different use.

 

If there was another BMW to consider, it would be this for me (but not in lieu of the 991S):


EDIT......

Or this M3:

 

I would make that point. is 50hp worth 15 grand(+tax) minimum (base comparison) when 95% of the time as a daily driver we're both limited to the same speed in and out of traffic?


That's the value for me. I don't track so I'd never use the top end of the 350hp this car came with.

 

The m3/m4 (non competition package, which will be released later I am sure) is rumored to be 0-60 in 4.3 with 26 MPG with ~425 hp. The m3 is the performance model of the 3 series and yes it has more juice than the base 911. Mind you it now has the turbo engine (gone are the amazing sounds of the N/A v8 engine) I was not impressed with the new m5 engine (I had an e60). The porsche build quality is better IMHO (though some of their tech is lacking in comparison to BMW). The m3/4 will be a good all around car (more spacious than the porsche too) but I will be using my 911 as a DD. I am also pretty confident the "S" and "4S" 911 models would come out on top in a straightline and on a track but we have to wait and see. For a pretty penny there's always the GT3s and Turbo 911s. I always cite Aston Martins as underpowered, especially for the premium you pay. Maybe it's just me but I don't think most people in a 911 pull up next to an M3 and think "wow I wish I had that car instead." Just my 2 cents.

 

I think that sums it up quite nicely.