Titanium bolts are in the house!
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 851
From: Pacific Northwest
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Ok, read and judge for your self. I for one, am satisfied that these bolts are better than stock.
Titanium Dreams
Marc Cook
Spring 2004 Robb Report
Scuderia Ferrari’s success in Formula 1 racing is the stuff of legend: In 686 races since the beginning of modern F/1 in 1950, the Italian company has won 167 times and earned 13 Drivers and Constructors championships. Ferrari’s achievements can be ascribed to a single-minded focus on attracting the best drivers and engineers and cultivating an unmatched will to win. In many ways, NCR Ducati is the Ferrari of motorcycle racing. The venerable Italian team has reached the pinnacle of World Superbike performance, particularly with the help of American Doug Polen in the late 1980s and early ’90s. Ferrari’s recent dominance of F/1 (and its storied racing history) and NCR Ducati’s sustained competitiveness share a common denominator: Stefano Poggipolini.
Stefano Poggipolini, the man behind the titanium artistry.
Poggipolini’s story begins near the historic city of Bologna in northern Italy, in the industrial complex in San Lazzaro di Savena, home of Poggipolini Titanium. Here, the Poggipolini family members have established themselves in metal fabrication and become some of the world’s finest crafters of titanium. Founded 50 years ago by 24-year-old entrepreneur Calisto Poggipolini, the Poggipolini Group (as it is now known) soon included a motorsports arm inspired by the founder’s sons, Stefano and Marco, both of whom were avid motocross racers. Signore Poggipolini fitted his boys’ dirt bikes with custom-fabricated aluminum componentsâ€â€anything to gain an advantage. Today the company is Stefano’s playground, and he has built Poggipolini Titanium into a force among manufacturers of exotic materials.
Titanium, a metal that is stronger than steel and lighter than aluminum, is among the cycling industry’s hottest commodities. When used in an alloy (a combination of raw materials designed for a specific purpose, say, exhaust systems or motorcycle frames) it boasts other desirable properties such as excellent corrosion resistance and superior heat conduction. Titanium is also an incredibly durable material when processed correctly. Known by its periodic symbol, Ti, the element is also used extensively in jet aircraft engines.
While it is true that the Poggipolini chain is driven by commercial titanium technologyâ€â€the company is involved in automotive, aircraft, nautical, and medical manufacturingâ€â€motorsports is at its heart. Stefano Poggipolini owns the rights to the NCR Ducati brand and supports the superbike squad with custom Ti designsâ€â€everything from titanium nuts and bolts to rearsets, clip-ons, clutch covers, and exotic connecting rods. (Some of these products are even available for retail purchase.) Poggipolini also supplies critical parts to Ferrari for its F/1 effort and is involved in a rapid prototyping process that helps keep teams such as Ferrari moving forward in the relentlessly cutting-edge sport of F/1 racing.
The interior of the Poggipolini factoryâ€â€it is a factory, even if the hum of state-of-the-art machinery and the exacting care with which it is operated suggest a design studio or operating roomâ€â€is lined with rows of the latest computer numerical control (CNC) equipment capable of cutting, welding, and shaping titanium in all its myriad forms: seamless rolled tubes, raw hunks of billet, refined extrusions, and cast pieces. CNC machinery is found in factories such as this throughout the world, but one of Poggipolini’s secrets is an emerging technology called stereo lithography (S-L). In this process, forms for casting new parts can be made directly from computer drawings. Leading manufacturers use stereo lithography to produce prototype parts during the development phase, then they turn to traditional permanent tooling for the mass production process.
Poggipolini follows this path, but with innovative twists. The company is a pioneer in applying a new technology developed by California-based 3D Systems called laser sintering. In traditional S-L, a laser is guided over a vat of epoxy resin that hardens on contact with the laser beam. The computer controlling this process produces a new part by exciting (and thereby hardening) the epoxy in layers, which are then reassembled into the desired piece, called a cast form.
But during Poggipolini’s laser sintering process, a very fine bed (20 microns, or 20 millionths of an inch) of powder, normally a glass nylon, is used in place of the epoxy resin. As with S-L, a laser tracks over the material, hardening it on contact. The computer commands the laser to pass over the material until the final shape is obtained, then the part is removed. The operator unearths the finished piece as though removing a gem from a sand castle, with the unreacted material falling away. As is true in conventional S-L, this part can then be used as a form for the investment casting of just about any kind of material, including titanium.
Laser sintering enables the forms to be much more detailed than with conventional S-L; thus, designers are freer to make the parts as light, as strongâ€â€and as beautiful as their knowledge and imagination allow. And at Poggipolini, there is never a shortage of either. Poggipolini’s sintering machines can produce components in a variety of materials-nylon, glass-filled nylon, rubber, stainless steel, and A6 metalsâ€â€including a proprietary material that blends alumina and nylon to form "aluminylon."
Because laser sintering creates forms that are much stronger than S-L materials yet still very light, new forms can be produced that are immediately ready to cast. To what end? There is no question that aerodynamic developments in F/1 come fast and furiously. Should Ferrari’s aerodynamicists create a sexier, more efficient new shape, it becomes Poggipolini’s job to render it for testing. Knowing time is of the essence, the company can respond almost instantly, receiving the CAD files over the Internet, porting them to its equipment, and offering a ready-to-try part by the time the morning shift arrives the next day.
Titanium Dreams
Marc Cook
Spring 2004 Robb Report
Scuderia Ferrari’s success in Formula 1 racing is the stuff of legend: In 686 races since the beginning of modern F/1 in 1950, the Italian company has won 167 times and earned 13 Drivers and Constructors championships. Ferrari’s achievements can be ascribed to a single-minded focus on attracting the best drivers and engineers and cultivating an unmatched will to win. In many ways, NCR Ducati is the Ferrari of motorcycle racing. The venerable Italian team has reached the pinnacle of World Superbike performance, particularly with the help of American Doug Polen in the late 1980s and early ’90s. Ferrari’s recent dominance of F/1 (and its storied racing history) and NCR Ducati’s sustained competitiveness share a common denominator: Stefano Poggipolini.
Stefano Poggipolini, the man behind the titanium artistry.
Poggipolini’s story begins near the historic city of Bologna in northern Italy, in the industrial complex in San Lazzaro di Savena, home of Poggipolini Titanium. Here, the Poggipolini family members have established themselves in metal fabrication and become some of the world’s finest crafters of titanium. Founded 50 years ago by 24-year-old entrepreneur Calisto Poggipolini, the Poggipolini Group (as it is now known) soon included a motorsports arm inspired by the founder’s sons, Stefano and Marco, both of whom were avid motocross racers. Signore Poggipolini fitted his boys’ dirt bikes with custom-fabricated aluminum componentsâ€â€anything to gain an advantage. Today the company is Stefano’s playground, and he has built Poggipolini Titanium into a force among manufacturers of exotic materials.
Titanium, a metal that is stronger than steel and lighter than aluminum, is among the cycling industry’s hottest commodities. When used in an alloy (a combination of raw materials designed for a specific purpose, say, exhaust systems or motorcycle frames) it boasts other desirable properties such as excellent corrosion resistance and superior heat conduction. Titanium is also an incredibly durable material when processed correctly. Known by its periodic symbol, Ti, the element is also used extensively in jet aircraft engines.
While it is true that the Poggipolini chain is driven by commercial titanium technologyâ€â€the company is involved in automotive, aircraft, nautical, and medical manufacturingâ€â€motorsports is at its heart. Stefano Poggipolini owns the rights to the NCR Ducati brand and supports the superbike squad with custom Ti designsâ€â€everything from titanium nuts and bolts to rearsets, clip-ons, clutch covers, and exotic connecting rods. (Some of these products are even available for retail purchase.) Poggipolini also supplies critical parts to Ferrari for its F/1 effort and is involved in a rapid prototyping process that helps keep teams such as Ferrari moving forward in the relentlessly cutting-edge sport of F/1 racing.
The interior of the Poggipolini factoryâ€â€it is a factory, even if the hum of state-of-the-art machinery and the exacting care with which it is operated suggest a design studio or operating roomâ€â€is lined with rows of the latest computer numerical control (CNC) equipment capable of cutting, welding, and shaping titanium in all its myriad forms: seamless rolled tubes, raw hunks of billet, refined extrusions, and cast pieces. CNC machinery is found in factories such as this throughout the world, but one of Poggipolini’s secrets is an emerging technology called stereo lithography (S-L). In this process, forms for casting new parts can be made directly from computer drawings. Leading manufacturers use stereo lithography to produce prototype parts during the development phase, then they turn to traditional permanent tooling for the mass production process.
Poggipolini follows this path, but with innovative twists. The company is a pioneer in applying a new technology developed by California-based 3D Systems called laser sintering. In traditional S-L, a laser is guided over a vat of epoxy resin that hardens on contact with the laser beam. The computer controlling this process produces a new part by exciting (and thereby hardening) the epoxy in layers, which are then reassembled into the desired piece, called a cast form.
But during Poggipolini’s laser sintering process, a very fine bed (20 microns, or 20 millionths of an inch) of powder, normally a glass nylon, is used in place of the epoxy resin. As with S-L, a laser tracks over the material, hardening it on contact. The computer commands the laser to pass over the material until the final shape is obtained, then the part is removed. The operator unearths the finished piece as though removing a gem from a sand castle, with the unreacted material falling away. As is true in conventional S-L, this part can then be used as a form for the investment casting of just about any kind of material, including titanium.
Laser sintering enables the forms to be much more detailed than with conventional S-L; thus, designers are freer to make the parts as light, as strongâ€â€and as beautiful as their knowledge and imagination allow. And at Poggipolini, there is never a shortage of either. Poggipolini’s sintering machines can produce components in a variety of materials-nylon, glass-filled nylon, rubber, stainless steel, and A6 metalsâ€â€including a proprietary material that blends alumina and nylon to form "aluminylon."
Because laser sintering creates forms that are much stronger than S-L materials yet still very light, new forms can be produced that are immediately ready to cast. To what end? There is no question that aerodynamic developments in F/1 come fast and furiously. Should Ferrari’s aerodynamicists create a sexier, more efficient new shape, it becomes Poggipolini’s job to render it for testing. Knowing time is of the essence, the company can respond almost instantly, receiving the CAD files over the Internet, porting them to its equipment, and offering a ready-to-try part by the time the morning shift arrives the next day.
Thread Starter
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Registered User
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,522
From: San Francisco
Rep Power: 83
Here is an initial response from the manufacturer. More to follow:
Actually, I shot a note off to Poggipolini regarding this very topic.
The first brief response in Italian/English:
1. compared to the steel, the titanium class 10.9 is much more lighter
than the steel of the same class;
2. the titanium is the best material against the working process
under stress, more than the steel same class, against all the
atmosphere elements (sand,rain,snow,..), it’s more elastic than the
steel same class.
3. About our working production process, the forged head and the
threads rolled improve a lot all the technical and mechanical
characteristics.
4. The Titanium used for the production of the Torx Ti. Bolts is
TITANIUM Grade 5, Ti 6Al4V, AMS 4928 (is the specification).
5. In some racing competitions the use of the Titanium is not allowed
because it could improve deeply the cars/bikes/... Performances.
I've been handling their Ti products on the motorcycle side for some
time. Titanium seems to be like men talking about women--everyone is
an expert but few really know what they're talking about. I'll get
some additional technical details from their catalog and forward to
you. The primary benefits are weight reduction and the material is
impervious to the elements (no rusting, corrosion) which is why it's
used in harsh chemical environments.
To be honest, I could never understand why car makers have $100K
automobiles with chromed steel wheel bolts. For Ferrari's roadgoing
racecar, the 360 Stradale, Poggipolini produces the Ti lug bolts for
that car and they come as standard equipment from the factory.
Actually, I shot a note off to Poggipolini regarding this very topic.
The first brief response in Italian/English:
1. compared to the steel, the titanium class 10.9 is much more lighter
than the steel of the same class;
2. the titanium is the best material against the working process
under stress, more than the steel same class, against all the
atmosphere elements (sand,rain,snow,..), it’s more elastic than the
steel same class.
3. About our working production process, the forged head and the
threads rolled improve a lot all the technical and mechanical
characteristics.
4. The Titanium used for the production of the Torx Ti. Bolts is
TITANIUM Grade 5, Ti 6Al4V, AMS 4928 (is the specification).
5. In some racing competitions the use of the Titanium is not allowed
because it could improve deeply the cars/bikes/... Performances.
I've been handling their Ti products on the motorcycle side for some
time. Titanium seems to be like men talking about women--everyone is
an expert but few really know what they're talking about. I'll get
some additional technical details from their catalog and forward to
you. The primary benefits are weight reduction and the material is
impervious to the elements (no rusting, corrosion) which is why it's
used in harsh chemical environments.
To be honest, I could never understand why car makers have $100K
automobiles with chromed steel wheel bolts. For Ferrari's roadgoing
racecar, the 360 Stradale, Poggipolini produces the Ti lug bolts for
that car and they come as standard equipment from the factory.
Thread Starter
|
Registered User
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,522
From: San Francisco
Rep Power: 83
Yeah, you're definately right, they are expensive. One of the benefits of being single is you get to blow your money any way you wish! Here's some general info regarding Ti that may be of interest:
About Titanium
GENERAL
Titanium is the fourth most abundant structural metal in the earth's crust, exceeded only by aluminum, iron, and magnesium. The ore can easily be seen as black beach sand where it is chemically bound with oxygen and iron. While titanium has been accessible to man since prehistoric times, it has taken modern metallurgy to transform these black sands into a usable metallic form. Today, this metal is processed into common material sizes. Shapes are produced by extrusion, investment casting and forging. Products are available in the low strength commercially pure grades as well as high strength alloys designed to meet exacting needs. In this country, shipments of titanium mill products now exceed 35 million pounds annually. Usage is primarily based on applications requiring high strength, light weight, and corrosion resistance.
USES
Titanium is the material designers reach for when nothing else will do. In the United States, over 70% of the titanium produced is consumed by the aerospace industry where the high strength to density ratio makes it a basic material of choice. The fastest growth, however, is occurring in the marine, industrial, and commercial sectors. The many unique properties of titanium are utilized in applications ranging from medical implants to high performance sports equipment.
SPACE VEHICLES - JET ENGINES - HEART VALVES BALLISTIC ARMOR - DEEP SEA SUBMERSIBLES - RACING CAR COMPONENTS - BICYCLE FRAMES
PROPERTIES
Titanium can often bridge the gap between aluminum and steel by providing many of the properties of each. Like aluminum, titanium has a low density and is non magnetic. At the same time, titanium has the high strength characteristics of steel coupled with corrosion resistance that is superior to stainless steel. Deep sea submersibles are designed with titanium pressure hulls utilizing this combination of properties.
MAGNETIC PROPERTIES
Titanium, like aluminum, is non magnetic and does not become magnetized when exposed to natural backgrounds or imposed magnetic fields. It is an ideal material for electronic containment cases and military applications where a non magnetic signature is required.
DENSITY
Titanium is more than 40% lighter than steel. For comparative analysis, Aluminum is approximately 0.12 lbs./cu.in., Steel is approximately 0.29 lbs./cu.in., and Titanium is approximately 0.16 lbs./cu.in.
CORROSION RESISTANCE
Titanium's outstanding corrosion resistance is due to the formation of a tightly adherent oxide film on its surface. When damaged, this thin invisible layer immediately reforms, maintaining a surface which is completely resistant to corrosive attack in sea water and all natural environments. This oxide is so resistant to corrosion that titanium components often look brand new even after years of service.
STRENGTH and HARDNESS
Commercially pure titanium grades are relatively soft and comparable in strength to aluminum. Strength and hardness can be increased by the addition of other elements such as aluminum, vanadium, oxygen, iron, chromium, molybdenum, etc. By far, the most common alloy in use today is Ti-6Al-4V, which contains 6% aluminum, 4% vanadium, and approximately 90% titanium. In the annealed condition, ultimate tensile strength is a minimum of 130,000 psi with a hardness in the Rockwell C (RC) 32 range. Heat treatment can increase the strength to 160,000 psi and a peak hardness of Rc 38. For additional strength, more highly alloyed grades are available at strength levels over 225,000 psi with peak hardness values up to Rc 48.
DURABILITY and HOLDING SHAPE
A durable material is one that will last, in spite of hard wear and frequent use. High strength, good ductility, toughness, corrosion resistance, fatigue strength, and wear resistance are necessary for durability. High strength titanium alloys have a unique combination of these properties. For this reason, titanium components, whether they be aerospace or industrial, are normally designed never to be replaced. Further, high strength titanium alloys are unique in maintaining their shape, even under high stress. This is due to a lower modulus of elasticity in combination with a high yield strength. A small diameter heat treated bar, for example, would be difficult to bend out of shape - even with the help of a vise.
About Titanium
GENERAL
Titanium is the fourth most abundant structural metal in the earth's crust, exceeded only by aluminum, iron, and magnesium. The ore can easily be seen as black beach sand where it is chemically bound with oxygen and iron. While titanium has been accessible to man since prehistoric times, it has taken modern metallurgy to transform these black sands into a usable metallic form. Today, this metal is processed into common material sizes. Shapes are produced by extrusion, investment casting and forging. Products are available in the low strength commercially pure grades as well as high strength alloys designed to meet exacting needs. In this country, shipments of titanium mill products now exceed 35 million pounds annually. Usage is primarily based on applications requiring high strength, light weight, and corrosion resistance.
USES
Titanium is the material designers reach for when nothing else will do. In the United States, over 70% of the titanium produced is consumed by the aerospace industry where the high strength to density ratio makes it a basic material of choice. The fastest growth, however, is occurring in the marine, industrial, and commercial sectors. The many unique properties of titanium are utilized in applications ranging from medical implants to high performance sports equipment.
SPACE VEHICLES - JET ENGINES - HEART VALVES BALLISTIC ARMOR - DEEP SEA SUBMERSIBLES - RACING CAR COMPONENTS - BICYCLE FRAMES
PROPERTIES
Titanium can often bridge the gap between aluminum and steel by providing many of the properties of each. Like aluminum, titanium has a low density and is non magnetic. At the same time, titanium has the high strength characteristics of steel coupled with corrosion resistance that is superior to stainless steel. Deep sea submersibles are designed with titanium pressure hulls utilizing this combination of properties.
MAGNETIC PROPERTIES
Titanium, like aluminum, is non magnetic and does not become magnetized when exposed to natural backgrounds or imposed magnetic fields. It is an ideal material for electronic containment cases and military applications where a non magnetic signature is required.
DENSITY
Titanium is more than 40% lighter than steel. For comparative analysis, Aluminum is approximately 0.12 lbs./cu.in., Steel is approximately 0.29 lbs./cu.in., and Titanium is approximately 0.16 lbs./cu.in.
CORROSION RESISTANCE
Titanium's outstanding corrosion resistance is due to the formation of a tightly adherent oxide film on its surface. When damaged, this thin invisible layer immediately reforms, maintaining a surface which is completely resistant to corrosive attack in sea water and all natural environments. This oxide is so resistant to corrosion that titanium components often look brand new even after years of service.
STRENGTH and HARDNESS
Commercially pure titanium grades are relatively soft and comparable in strength to aluminum. Strength and hardness can be increased by the addition of other elements such as aluminum, vanadium, oxygen, iron, chromium, molybdenum, etc. By far, the most common alloy in use today is Ti-6Al-4V, which contains 6% aluminum, 4% vanadium, and approximately 90% titanium. In the annealed condition, ultimate tensile strength is a minimum of 130,000 psi with a hardness in the Rockwell C (RC) 32 range. Heat treatment can increase the strength to 160,000 psi and a peak hardness of Rc 38. For additional strength, more highly alloyed grades are available at strength levels over 225,000 psi with peak hardness values up to Rc 48.
DURABILITY and HOLDING SHAPE
A durable material is one that will last, in spite of hard wear and frequent use. High strength, good ductility, toughness, corrosion resistance, fatigue strength, and wear resistance are necessary for durability. High strength titanium alloys have a unique combination of these properties. For this reason, titanium components, whether they be aerospace or industrial, are normally designed never to be replaced. Further, high strength titanium alloys are unique in maintaining their shape, even under high stress. This is due to a lower modulus of elasticity in combination with a high yield strength. A small diameter heat treated bar, for example, would be difficult to bend out of shape - even with the help of a vise.
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Poggipolini is a well known company who do alot of sport bike titanium bolts for some time now. If I was after maximum weight reduction on my turbo, I wouldn't hesitate to go for their bolts. On a GT3 or a GT2, I wouldn't even think twice about it.
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Joined: Apr 2006
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We distribute the Poggipolini bolts on our Motorcycle website.
We stock the 996 bolts but if you are running the 5mm spacer, it will require 5mm longer bolts. We would have to order the longer ones from Italy.
We stock the 996 bolts but if you are running the 5mm spacer, it will require 5mm longer bolts. We would have to order the longer ones from Italy.
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,260
From: Austin
Rep Power: 770
Originally Posted by moto
We distribute the Poggipolini bolts on our Motorcycle website.
We stock the 996 bolts but if you are running the 5mm spacer, it will require 5mm longer bolts. We would have to order the longer ones from Italy.
We stock the 996 bolts but if you are running the 5mm spacer, it will require 5mm longer bolts. We would have to order the longer ones from Italy.
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 143
From: Sacramento
Rep Power: 31
Titanium Wheel Bolts: Porsche
You can also get the bolts from Arling at LUCENT.
They are more than they used to be due to the exchange rate and cost of titanium. We won't be bringing in too many of those anymore as they have gone up again...
You can also get the bolts from Arling at LUCENT.
They are more than they used to be due to the exchange rate and cost of titanium. We won't be bringing in too many of those anymore as they have gone up again...
Last edited by moto; Aug 29, 2007 at 11:31 PM.
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 369
From: Australia
Rep Power: 35
I'll buy you lunch if some stranger ever comes up and says "wow, nice lugs" 
[/QUOTE] Deputydog95
I have Titanium lugs and bolts with wheel spacers front and rear...no stranger has ever complimented me on them...but the guys at the tyre shop were blown away by how light they were!
[/QUOTE] Deputydog95I have Titanium lugs and bolts with wheel spacers front and rear...no stranger has ever complimented me on them...but the guys at the tyre shop were blown away by how light they were!
