I have an EFR 8374 IWG in my non-Porsche car and I love it. It have a nice internal wastegate with a boost solenoid included that works really well. No boost control issues whatsoever, using a standalone ecu though... It also have an integrated BOV. All integrated in one unit. Brilliant Yes it is quite expensive, but add a wastegate, BOV and a boost solenoid to another brand ball bearing turbo, I am pretty sure it wont be cheaper, and you still havent the lightweight exhaust wheel for excellent transient spool that the EFR have

 

Is there any advantage to these over A28s on a pump gas stock motor car? Low spool and torque are already kind of danger zone on the tials.

 

The hardware itself doesn't impost the danger, its the tuners job to properly manage tq and boost at all rpms.

 

Agreed, what I'm asking though is that considering there is a restriction on the amount of tq that can be safely run down low there wouldn't be an advantage to using say a faster spooling turbo in order to gain greater torque down low as it would have to be tuned out regardless. So in my example what would be gained from one of these turbos that A28s could not provide?

 

The 7163's can push over 1000awhp, gt28 not same class. The aero is entirely different, 7163 is a lower pr design than the 28/30

 

So similar spool but the efr would be better for big power if building the engine later down the line? Sorry for all the questions just trying to understand the options available.

 

Correct.

 

im not sure why the hostility. as i said i ran both 3071 and 3073 before the 7163 setup thats going into my car now. both tials with precision external w/g and turbosmart w/g. so lets do your math. tial 3071 turbos run 5600$ a set of precision w/g are 500$ the gmg headers i had were 1500$ labor to install v bands was 1 hr at 100$ per. also add dumps. tial bov (2) was 500$ custom y pipe was 1000$ thats a total 9200$ for the exact setup you want so bad. im keeping my y bpipe and bov so lets deduct 1500 for a total of 7700$ the 7163 turbos retail for 5000$ ALL IN. a savings of 2700$ and they have more power than either of the tials i had. darrins turbo spools 1 bar boost 3300 with his 7163 setup. almost 500 rpm faster than my 3071 did. im also on proefi so we monitor everything. simply put the 7163 are a better all around turbo . as for noise i run a 3" catless exhaust w/ w/g dumps right to the ground. with the chatter from the c/f triple disk clutch and the catless exhaust its obvious i dont care what they sound like.

im not sure what you drove in the past but those prices are what the porsche market holds. if its not to your liking maybe this isnt the car for you. i hope that clears things up forn you since i actually had all of these turbos and you havent

 

it's funny that zero400 doesnt trust the internal recirc valve, he must know something the Porsche/BW engineers don't seeing as its the exact same part/valve on the stock VTG...

 

Haha true. I can say I switched to billet covers on them just bought a few guys had broken the plastic nips of when doing stuff underhand on car but they are fair cheap and not a must. The internal gates do have a limit of flow but you can do a minor port job on the recirculation hole to get more flow of needed........I did port one before and is easy to do but even in that case it was not needed, I was already porting the rest of the turbo

 

There really isn't a flow issue on the internally gated hotside. If anything keeping the large flapper shut has been an issue as its so large the pressure on such a large flapper overcomes the standard gates at relatively low boost. 25psi or dual ported internal gates are a must to run over 3:1 pr

We are lucky to have a relationship with some of the big shops at the speedway here in Vegas, one of which has been working closely with BW collecting real world data to better the EFR line.

 

I love everything I have read about the EFR turbos - and love Sean - but think it's un proven how the big AR will spool on what is effectively a 1.8L engine. (A stock, low compression engine) ......
Because of the ar I expect the PR to improve over the tials which are .63 (or smaller when compared to the vband) housings.

Yes the areo and material is better - much better. And I've heard nothing but great things about the transient response. I'm excited to see the results.

 

Poking at me with those comments calling me a biggot? On what merrit, that I joined about a month back? I see.

What's "correct" above exactly? 28s now spool 'similar' to this 7163 setup. Are you serious? Its at least 800-1000rpm difference between them. Completely different leagues. If your goal is 1000+ they are a great option. They are not as spool happy period. Post a stock motor dyno and let's talk again then.

I don't know why this great option you are making for those looking for this particular turbo is suddenly being positioned as the end all be all. Enlighten me?

In terms of all that you listed parts wise I just want an equal length header, external gates and bovs. How many serious street or drag setups are running on this sort of internal gate or built in bpv style setup? Please let's not go there. EFRs are not even on the map other than sounding cool on paper with all the gadgetry.

Gt30 turbine old tech has proven itself rock solid reliable and spools just the same. Is it their problem they figured it out so long ago?

Let's not pointlessly argue and show some valid comparison results unlike the perrin article. If you were part of the Subaru community back then you'd know why it turned out to be flawed. Google is your friend.

 

I was talking about the bov recirc port not the wastegate. Gates are very large

 

A 7163 will spool a tad slower than a a28 yes but I'd still take an efr over an alpha turbo but to each his one.
On the flip side here I'd a video of some 6258s for ya built by a bender on this site so you can ask for real world experience from them.
https://youtu.be/Gh8YPekzdZ8