997 2005-2012 911 C2, C2S, C4, C4S, GTS, Targa and Cabriolet Model Discussion.
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997 C2 vs C4 dyno numbers

Old Mar 15, 2009 | 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by fischb
True true. My 335 xi with Dinan V2 and exhaust mods put down 337 rwhp at altitude (Denver). With all the fudge factors we figures crank HP to be a little over 400, meaning the stock engine would have to be around 325. There is no doubt the modified 335xi is way torqueier than both the M3's and my 997 (targa) C4s, at least IMHO.

This is my first Porsche. I find the real life power curve way different than the BMW. It might be because the amazing PDK smooths everything out so much.
Altitude affects Naturally aspirated cars more than turbo cars. This why your Porsche is slower than it should be compared to your 335 where you live. Regardless of altitude though, the 335 engine, especialy when boosted, produces some good torque and feels very responsive. Btw, I don't know how long you've had the car but congrats!
 
Old Mar 15, 2009 | 07:02 PM
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Originally Posted by NorthVan997C2S
Remember the age old saying;

Horsepower sells cars, Torque wins races!
You know why it's an "old" saying, right?

"The world is flat" is also an old saying.

Whomever said, and whomever believes the quoted statement, apparently never watches racing. Check F1/Indycar/NASCAR/whatever.

Now, talk about "street heroes" might be closer to correct, as HP really matters MUCH more on the track, and much LESS on the street than torque.
 
Old Mar 15, 2009 | 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Kurt_OH
You know why it's an "old" saying, right?

"The world is flat" is also an old saying.

Whomever said, and whomever believes the quoted statement, apparently never watches racing. Check F1/Indycar/NASCAR/whatever.

Now, talk about "street heroes" might be closer to correct, as HP really matters MUCH more on the track, and much LESS on the street than torque.
Well, actualy, you are both right. As HP is a derivative of torque. As HP numbers are calculated
HP = rpm x torque
5252

Essentialy, HP is torque produced at a rate...

HP as a peak number is a better indicator of engine performance than torque as a peak number.

I think the old saying misleads by saying torque wins races... It's more like a good torque curve wins races... But that doesn't really mean much as a car with a good torque curve would have a good HP curve too Coming back to what i mentioned earlier about HP as a peak number being a better indicator of performance than torque, I give this example: Lets take engine A and engine B: Engine A produces 500 HP and engine B produces 500 Torque both being peak numbers. Based on that info only, we don't know if engine B is a good motor for racing purposes, it could produce that over a very narrow range at low rpms (i.e. truck motor) and would not be a good race engine. Then again, if it produced that kind of torque at high rpms and/or over a wide range, that would be one hell of a motor. As for engine A, there is less guesswork, if you can produced 500hp, even though you might not have a crazy torque curve, we can still gear the car up in a way to keep the engine in its sweet spot to produce good performance and produce some crazy drive force to the ground...

So coming back to what I said earlier: HP as a peak number is a much better indicator of engine performance than torque... AND having a good torque curve that peaks at high rpms is indication of a good for performance motor...

Having said all this, so those old sayings don't really mean much and oversimplify things... Gonna go sleep now, I've online-blabbed too much today.
 
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