tt S vs 2012 GT-R
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Since when does my car need any setting to use launch control?
I do not have to use any setting to launch. And I am completely covered by warranty. Do I launch with VDC-off? No. No need to.
I press brake, press gas, release brake.
I believe you're reading too much into this. VDC-off is not required to launch.
*edit: I'll repeat - LC2, 3, 4 is covered under warranty (in other words, every GT-R being sold for the last 2+ years (and retroactively, every other GT-R, who brought their cars in to get this program). LC does not require VDC to be off, which negates the warranty verbage you've pasted here.
I do not have to use any setting to launch. And I am completely covered by warranty. Do I launch with VDC-off? No. No need to.
I press brake, press gas, release brake.
I believe you're reading too much into this. VDC-off is not required to launch.
*edit: I'll repeat - LC2, 3, 4 is covered under warranty (in other words, every GT-R being sold for the last 2+ years (and retroactively, every other GT-R, who brought their cars in to get this program). LC does not require VDC to be off, which negates the warranty verbage you've pasted here.
how does the car behave when launched with VDC on? That is the same as my PSM and I would think you would be faster with it off?
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Jasper, since you seem to know a lot about this whole issue, is there any idea as to how many actual cars had tranny problems? Stock cars vs modded cars. I don't think any manufacturer would warranty a tranny on a modded car so I don't think it is fair to include blown transmissions of modded cars, like the video of the one at the drags that blew it's tranny on launch. That car was modded or I thought it was anyway.
how does the car behave when launched with VDC on? That is the same as my PSM and I would think you would be faster with it off?
how does the car behave when launched with VDC on? That is the same as my PSM and I would think you would be faster with it off?
Anyway - I launch in the VDC-R setting, and have only lost traction once (bad track prep). I have LC2. I hear that LC4 is almost right back up to LC1 RPM levels, but use the VDC-R setting. VDC-on only worked for me once. I always lose traction now (with VDC-normal), especially because I've modded a little bit.
If somebody adds a lot of power, LC in VDC-R might be difficult (on street tires), and may opt for the VDC-off choice. But then, your fate is in your hands.
But now that Cobb AP can reprogram LC, it is practically a non-issue now, because people with any LC can launch at any RPM they want to (for modded cars). That said, sleepdoc (on NAGTROC) has been launching on some pretty decent power for quite some time. A lot may depend on frequency, and preventing abuse (multiple subsequent launches). Anyway, he just ran a 10.003 on stock internals, stock turbos, and stock transmission.
Last edited by jaspergtr; Mar 19, 2011 at 02:40 PM.
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I wonder what the difference in the 1/4 mile is without using LC and using it, has anyone done comparisons. I have LC on my M5 and honestly never use it as I am afraid of leaving transmission parts strewn across the 1/4 mile 
The car is covered under warranty if I use it, and I know a few people that use it religiously with no problems. Still, I have never been a fan of manual clutch dumps above 3400 rpm or high rpm launch control, just seems extremely abusive, especially if your tires hook up. .
The car is covered under warranty if I use it, and I know a few people that use it religiously with no problems. Still, I have never been a fan of manual clutch dumps above 3400 rpm or high rpm launch control, just seems extremely abusive, especially if your tires hook up. .
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Yeah, it's called Nissan and NAGTROC 
NISSANS OWN WORDS...TRANNY NOT COVERED!!! WHEN VDC OFF!!!
http://www.2009gtr.com/2009/04/2010-...agreement.html
Are there people still perpetuating the idea that it IS covered?
From your own brethren on nagtroc.
So where does NISSAN state differently?
NISSANS OWN WORDS...TRANNY NOT COVERED!!! WHEN VDC OFF!!!
http://www.2009gtr.com/2009/04/2010-...agreement.html
Are there people still perpetuating the idea that it IS covered?
From your own brethren on nagtroc.
So where does NISSAN state differently?
The GT-R's sophisticated drive-train logic controls require that the VDC remain ON to protect components from encountering abnormal stress. What may I ask is wrong with that? It is truly no different than an ECU changing the engine timing based on computer algorithms, which prevents early detonation that can break piston rods. So would you want to turn off this feature in the ECU? The answer is obviously "NO!" unless you are a moron. The GT-R was designed to have the VDC ON at all times. Turning the VDC OFF was originally only for special circumstances as explained in the video above. I believe the idea of a "Launch Control" came about only later by someone (dealers?). I think the Japanese engineers also really underestimated America's infatuation with straight line acceleration. Nurburgring, what's that?
Following your line of thought Prche951, every owner should be able to configure their car's ECU any way they want without voiding their car's warranty. Let us also keep the warranty for those who put Canola oil in their car's engine because it is "more green" toward the environment. And any moron who plugs their 110 volt stereo into a 220 volt socket in order to increase "power wattage output", should also benefit from the manufactures warranty coverage after it fries!
I actually applaud Nissan for their "black box" technology that tracks a driver's behavior, which you clearly disdain. The box defeats morons who really do abuse their car, which ultimately leads to price inflation for responsible car owners. So if Porsche doesn't monitor behavior, I think it has technologically just fallen behind again.
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Following your line of thought Prche951, every owner should be able to configure their car's ECU any way they want without voiding their car's warranty. Let us also keep the warranty for those who put Canola oil in their car's engine because it is "more green" toward the environment. And any moron who plugs their 110 volt stereo into a 220 volt socket in order to increase "power wattage output", should also benefit from the manufactures warranty coverage after it fries!
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However, many other car choices exist for those who really can't stand a "box". I have yet to hear of a GT-R owner who bought his car because of a gun being placed to his head. Nissan also explained the "Black Box" to me before I bought my car; so I bought my GT-R with eyes open. It is no big deal to me since it really is a buyer's decision, as it should be. If you don't like it, don't buy it, this is the way capitalism works for now thank God.
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I agree with you that the "nanny box" is no fun for those wanting to abuse the car, or for those owners who are very deceitful when it comes to getting warranty work done when it was their fault in the first place. I also cannot blame a company for trying to protect their product warranty against exploitation, especially in an "inexpensive" supercar.
However, many other car choices exist for those who really can't stand a "box". I have yet to hear of a GT-R owner who bought his car because of a gun being placed to his head. Nissan also explained the "Black Box" to me before I bought my car; so I bought my GT-R with eyes open. It is no big deal to me since it really is a buyer's decision, as it should be. If you don't like it, don't buy it, this is the way capitalism works for now thank God.
However, many other car choices exist for those who really can't stand a "box". I have yet to hear of a GT-R owner who bought his car because of a gun being placed to his head. Nissan also explained the "Black Box" to me before I bought my car; so I bought my GT-R with eyes open. It is no big deal to me since it really is a buyer's decision, as it should be. If you don't like it, don't buy it, this is the way capitalism works for now thank God.
I wished my G35 had it, though. My brakes wore down prematurely (the one part I haven't modified up to that point). I took it into the dealer, and the service rep said if I drive hard, that will happen. I tried to tell him, I haven't driven it hard, yet. He didn't believe me - and I couldn't claim it under warranty (like a lot of other people did for that model/year).
On the GT-R, it came in handy... I thought I had something wrong with my front end (vibration). They pulled up my data, saw my driving (launches, track stuff, mods), and saw that there is nothing I ever did to the car that would indicate abuse, and upheld my warranty.
The black box is only inconvenient to liars and cheaters. All others can enjoy the lack of a disagreement between an uptight service rep and a customer trying to sell him a bunch o' crap.
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I haven't decided yet? Nothing for a few months at least! I wanted a red one and I was going to buy a new 2012, so I sold my 2009 in preparation and because I was offered top dollar (68k). When the new one came in I really didn't like the new stuff on the exterior or interior, I think the first generation has a cleaner looking exterior and better looking wheels IMO and I also think the first Gen has a prettier interior. But thats all my opinion and maybe no one agrees? but since its going to be my car I got to get what I like so I got a 2010 Red car with the light grey interior which is my favorite combination. I bought it brand new at the dealer for $73035 which was about $25k cheaper than the 2012 they sold the day before, and for that kind of discount I am liking the 2010! Jack told me he can reprogram all my 2009 tunes to the new car for 190 dollars, so I sent out the cobb to him for that.
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F.Y.I.
AP HEADLINE TODAY: WASHINGTON D.C. -- Angry American driver wrecks 10 new cars at Non-U.S. Government Car Dealership today.
A man went on a driving rampage today (due to temporary insanity) after learning about a so-called "Black Box" in his newly purchased Nissan GT-R. This "Black Box" led Nissan to void the man's new car warranty after his abusive driving behavior was discovered.
Several U.S. Senators, all GM and Chrysler owners who have never ever received any kickbacks whatsoever, are now demanding a federal investigation into Nissan's "Black Box" technology which now limits the innate rights of drivers. These Senators state Nissan for years has unfairly applied their advanced automotive technology without remorse. They feel large import duties against Nissan are now justified to "finally even out the automotive playing field".
After discovering that this driver has no health insurance and is an American union worker, a White House spokesperson today stated that President Obama will pardon him during a Live 30 minute TV town-rally tonight at 8:00 PM E.S.T. which is titled "Can't all Americans just get along".
AP HEADLINE TODAY: WASHINGTON D.C. -- Angry American driver wrecks 10 new cars at Non-U.S. Government Car Dealership today.
A man went on a driving rampage today (due to temporary insanity) after learning about a so-called "Black Box" in his newly purchased Nissan GT-R. This "Black Box" led Nissan to void the man's new car warranty after his abusive driving behavior was discovered.
Several U.S. Senators, all GM and Chrysler owners who have never ever received any kickbacks whatsoever, are now demanding a federal investigation into Nissan's "Black Box" technology which now limits the innate rights of drivers. These Senators state Nissan for years has unfairly applied their advanced automotive technology without remorse. They feel large import duties against Nissan are now justified to "finally even out the automotive playing field".
After discovering that this driver has no health insurance and is an American union worker, a White House spokesperson today stated that President Obama will pardon him during a Live 30 minute TV town-rally tonight at 8:00 PM E.S.T. which is titled "Can't all Americans just get along".
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I haven't decided yet? Nothing for a few months at least! I wanted a red one and I was going to buy a new 2012, so I sold my 2009 in preparation and because I was offered top dollar (68k). When the new one came in I really didn't like the new stuff on the exterior or interior, I think the first generation has a cleaner looking exterior and better looking wheels IMO and I also think the first Gen has a prettier interior. But thats all my opinion and maybe no one agrees? but since its going to be my car I got to get what I like so I got a 2010 Red car with the light grey interior which is my favorite combination. I bought it brand new at the dealer for $73035 which was about $25k cheaper than the 2012 they sold the day before, and for that kind of discount I am liking the 2010! Jack told me he can reprogram all my 2009 tunes to the new car for 190 dollars, so I sent out the cobb to him for that.
I bought a new 2010 GT-R on Dec. 21, 2010.
Why did I pull the trigger on a 2010 and not wait for a 2012? Here is my reasoning.
1 A new 2012 would cost about $14,000 more.
2 The 2012 has 522 bhp vs 485 bhp (37 bhp more) over the 2010 model due to new intake and exhaust. But for the 2010 you can buy a ECU flash kit and a middle-pipe (a problem) for $2,000 and gain 100 bhp. You can currently also buy larger intake piping to make even more bhp if you wanted too.
3 I don't like the look of the 2012's new wheels. There are some minor suspension changes to improve under-steer, and some electronic gizmo changes that really do not improve performance. You can also buy after-market improvements to the 2010's suspension if you want, which appears to do the same thing. Current ride stiffness is OK with me in the 2010, I like it.
4 The 2012 has newer seats and a newly refined interior (they say). I really don't care too much about all that. The 2010 model is "all business" and the interior is the best of any car I have ever owned in the past. Barking up the wrong tree here for me, otherwise I would have bought a Mercedes.
5 The difference between the 2012 vs 2010 model was asked of a test car driver who had just track test driven the 2012. When pressed to comment, he said "it (the 2012 model) is only a minor improvement" over the original car design which is excellent on the track. This comment finally made up my mind which to buy (or upgrade).
6 The 2009-2011 models have a lot of aftermarket support by tuners now and parts are also more available. The 2012-2013 will be the last of the R-35 models made, with less parts available because of less sold in the USA. Service techs in my area will see more 2009-2011 cars vs none of the 2012 model. US Release dates and Production numbers posted on NAGTROC show Premium will be released on 2/3/2011 with 748 Units and Black Edition released on 4/3/2011 with only 403 units.
7 Invest the same amount of money in a new 2010 as in a 2012, and you can gain 175 whp.
8 Overall, the 2012 did not seem to offer that much improvement and I like actually like the look of the 2010 better (LED running lights do not turn me on). On the track, I probably would never be able to tell the difference between the two models anyway, unless I trained to become a professional driver LOL! And that will never happen! 7:20 vs 7:26 on the ring is just bragging rights and does not really impact me at all in the real world. But perhaps a modified 2010 to perform a 2.6s 0-60 vs a 2012 3.0s does.
Why did I pull the trigger on a 2010 and not wait for a 2012? Here is my reasoning.
1 A new 2012 would cost about $14,000 more.
2 The 2012 has 522 bhp vs 485 bhp (37 bhp more) over the 2010 model due to new intake and exhaust. But for the 2010 you can buy a ECU flash kit and a middle-pipe (a problem) for $2,000 and gain 100 bhp. You can currently also buy larger intake piping to make even more bhp if you wanted too.
3 I don't like the look of the 2012's new wheels. There are some minor suspension changes to improve under-steer, and some electronic gizmo changes that really do not improve performance. You can also buy after-market improvements to the 2010's suspension if you want, which appears to do the same thing. Current ride stiffness is OK with me in the 2010, I like it.
4 The 2012 has newer seats and a newly refined interior (they say). I really don't care too much about all that. The 2010 model is "all business" and the interior is the best of any car I have ever owned in the past. Barking up the wrong tree here for me, otherwise I would have bought a Mercedes.
5 The difference between the 2012 vs 2010 model was asked of a test car driver who had just track test driven the 2012. When pressed to comment, he said "it (the 2012 model) is only a minor improvement" over the original car design which is excellent on the track. This comment finally made up my mind which to buy (or upgrade).
6 The 2009-2011 models have a lot of aftermarket support by tuners now and parts are also more available. The 2012-2013 will be the last of the R-35 models made, with less parts available because of less sold in the USA. Service techs in my area will see more 2009-2011 cars vs none of the 2012 model. US Release dates and Production numbers posted on NAGTROC show Premium will be released on 2/3/2011 with 748 Units and Black Edition released on 4/3/2011 with only 403 units.
7 Invest the same amount of money in a new 2010 as in a 2012, and you can gain 175 whp.
8 Overall, the 2012 did not seem to offer that much improvement and I like actually like the look of the 2010 better (LED running lights do not turn me on). On the track, I probably would never be able to tell the difference between the two models anyway, unless I trained to become a professional driver LOL! And that will never happen! 7:20 vs 7:26 on the ring is just bragging rights and does not really impact me at all in the real world. But perhaps a modified 2010 to perform a 2.6s 0-60 vs a 2012 3.0s does.
Last edited by Tachsman; Mar 20, 2011 at 04:03 PM.
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Perhaps Nissan adds the 'Black Box' in case buyers think they bought a Porsche!!!
Seriously, if I spend $100K on a top shelf sports car with paddles, the technology better let me drive it the way a want to. The phrase 'abusive driving' is Nissan's - not the $100K invested owner.
'Abusive driving' to me would constitute neglecting oil changes over 10s of thousands of miles or otherwise failing to maintain - not what the seller tells me is OK.
This Black Box thing is a small mark against this otherwise fascinating car.
Seriously, if I spend $100K on a top shelf sports car with paddles, the technology better let me drive it the way a want to. The phrase 'abusive driving' is Nissan's - not the $100K invested owner.
'Abusive driving' to me would constitute neglecting oil changes over 10s of thousands of miles or otherwise failing to maintain - not what the seller tells me is OK.
This Black Box thing is a small mark against this otherwise fascinating car.
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Perhaps Nissan adds the 'Black Box' in case buyers think they bought a Porsche!!!
Seriously, if I spend $100K on a top shelf sports car with paddles, the technology better let me drive it the way a want to. The phrase 'abusive driving' is Nissan's - not the $100K invested owner.
'Abusive driving' to me would constitute neglecting oil changes over 10s of thousands of miles or otherwise failing to maintain - not what the seller tells me is OK.
This Black Box thing is a small mark against this otherwise fascinating car.
Seriously, if I spend $100K on a top shelf sports car with paddles, the technology better let me drive it the way a want to. The phrase 'abusive driving' is Nissan's - not the $100K invested owner.
'Abusive driving' to me would constitute neglecting oil changes over 10s of thousands of miles or otherwise failing to maintain - not what the seller tells me is OK.
This Black Box thing is a small mark against this otherwise fascinating car.
I'm intrigued... What do you think the dealer would call abusive, and what would you consider not abusive (where do you think the disagreement would be)?