Nissan GT-R Superior?
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It would seem Pcar fan boy camp has left out a possible reason why the GTR may be generating notably higher corner speeds than the 997tt or Vette... And it's not "cheating" --ACTIVE SUSPENSION. A HEAVIER same hp car CAN be faster around the track with a PROPER active suspension. F1 has proven that easily enough.
One of the first things I noticed viewing the GTR 'ring video was the amount of tire squealing. There was a lot of it. The tires were really working. That means, IF the vid is real, then it's consistent with a very well set up car. It allows the driver to balance grip to a maximum. I realize it could've been dubbed, or fake altogether. But it looked pretty good to me.
Now I don't have a GTR or a 997tt, YET, so I'm open minded. However, I do leave myself OPEN to a result that the GTR IS a faster car. Because I believe the overwhelming data shows it is. Some guys can't see past what they want to see because it doesn't fit their eccentricities. Through their limited experience, they say a heavier car can't win, because they've never seen one, so they declare a flat world, trashing what is evidenced by others. Their world is a conspiracy. I say, the vast data field of reputable sources is overwhelming -- the contrary is a rare bird -- I think it highly unlikely every single report is a Nissan conspiracy.
That being said, since I don't have either, I can't say for certain. I'd bet though, odds are the GTR is faster because of all the above.
BTW, I can anticipate the Pcar die hard objecting saying driver's aids are for girls argument, that the 997tt is more visceral, engaging...etc... which I would reply is the ox cart vs. car argument... please don't go there.
One of the first things I noticed viewing the GTR 'ring video was the amount of tire squealing. There was a lot of it. The tires were really working. That means, IF the vid is real, then it's consistent with a very well set up car. It allows the driver to balance grip to a maximum. I realize it could've been dubbed, or fake altogether. But it looked pretty good to me.
Now I don't have a GTR or a 997tt, YET, so I'm open minded. However, I do leave myself OPEN to a result that the GTR IS a faster car. Because I believe the overwhelming data shows it is. Some guys can't see past what they want to see because it doesn't fit their eccentricities. Through their limited experience, they say a heavier car can't win, because they've never seen one, so they declare a flat world, trashing what is evidenced by others. Their world is a conspiracy. I say, the vast data field of reputable sources is overwhelming -- the contrary is a rare bird -- I think it highly unlikely every single report is a Nissan conspiracy.
That being said, since I don't have either, I can't say for certain. I'd bet though, odds are the GTR is faster because of all the above.
BTW, I can anticipate the Pcar die hard objecting saying driver's aids are for girls argument, that the 997tt is more visceral, engaging...etc... which I would reply is the ox cart vs. car argument... please don't go there.
Last edited by mister_jkd; Apr 10, 2008 at 10:05 AM.
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I hate all these "unconfirmed" 'Ring lap times....
Nissan does 7:38, and it's videotaped. Then sport auto mag has Von Saurma take a GTR and get it done in 7:54! Hmmm... quite a difference. They plan to retest it next year with a REAL production vehicle.
Lexus does it in 7:15 with their LFA concept! BMW M3 can lap faster than a Carrera S! z06 does it in 7:42 sec!
All of these ridiculous claims have been proven FALSE! All done for and by MARKETING!
Fanboys, non-owners, and haters love these media reports because it's all they got. They are walking advertisements for these companies.
6speed is a community of enthusiasts, in where a large majority of us OWN our cars and discuss. Sorry if you take offense to us not recognizing you or your opinion, but we have yet to see any value that any low posting, non-owner has to offer.
All we've seen from you guys is "I drove my friend's THIS, my dad's THAT, my cousin's THIS is faster than THAT on Gran Turismo 4 for PS3, blah blah blah"
Come back here when you own your GTR, take a picture with it, and meet us on the track!
Nissan does 7:38, and it's videotaped. Then sport auto mag has Von Saurma take a GTR and get it done in 7:54! Hmmm... quite a difference. They plan to retest it next year with a REAL production vehicle.
Lexus does it in 7:15 with their LFA concept! BMW M3 can lap faster than a Carrera S! z06 does it in 7:42 sec!
All of these ridiculous claims have been proven FALSE! All done for and by MARKETING!
Fanboys, non-owners, and haters love these media reports because it's all they got. They are walking advertisements for these companies.
6speed is a community of enthusiasts, in where a large majority of us OWN our cars and discuss. Sorry if you take offense to us not recognizing you or your opinion, but we have yet to see any value that any low posting, non-owner has to offer.
All we've seen from you guys is "I drove my friend's THIS, my dad's THAT, my cousin's THIS is faster than THAT on Gran Turismo 4 for PS3, blah blah blah"
Come back here when you own your GTR, take a picture with it, and meet us on the track!
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Based on this response, I rest my case. Let me know when you own something. I love guys that have an opinion on something that they never had to stroke a check for. Your decision has a much bigger impact when you have to acutally pay for it. Like they say, "Talk is cheap."
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Do you own a GT-R? No. In that case your opinion is as worthless as mine...you may not think so, since you seem to hold your nose so high in the air. I guess around here you have to own a Porsche in order to gain the "status" to be entitled to an opinion on anthing that even in the SLIGHTEST goes against the Porsche fanbase. Of course my decision has a much bigger impact when I actually have to pay for something, that's why I would get the GT-R as I mentioned. What's your point? Like I said, if I was only going to track the car occasionally or not much at all, and my bank account allowed, I would likely go with the Turbo in a 6 speed. I gaurantee you if I came in here with a signature saying that I owned some type of 911, everyone wouldn't have bombarded me with negativety...haters. .
I think the biggest difference is that a majority of 6speed members could go out and buy a Z06 or a Gtr, but we choose not to. There are a lot of things to consider when you PAY for a vehicle that is closing in on 6 figures. If and when you do that one day, you'll know that it is a lot harder to stroke a check for 80k for a Nissan, than stroking a 100k check for a Porsche. I think if you get that opportunity one day, my words will come back to haunt you. Good luck.
Last edited by 9Eleven; Apr 10, 2008 at 11:22 AM.
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I hate all these "unconfirmed" 'Ring lap times....
Nissan does 7:38, and it's videotaped. Then sport auto mag has Von Saurma take a GTR and get it done in 7:54! Hmmm... quite a difference. They plan to retest it next year with a REAL production vehicle.
Lexus does it in 7:15 with their LFA concept! BMW M3 can lap faster than a Carrera S! z06 does it in 7:42 sec!
All of these ridiculous claims have been proven FALSE! All done for and by MARKETING!
Fanboys, non-owners, and haters love these media reports because it's all they got. They are walking advertisements for these companies.
6speed is a community of enthusiasts, in where a large majority of us OWN our cars and discuss. Sorry if you take offense to us not recognizing you or your opinion, but we have yet to see any value that any low posting, non-owner has to offer.
All we've seen from you guys is "I drove my friend's THIS, my dad's THAT, my cousin's THIS is faster than THAT on Gran Turismo 4 for PS3, blah blah blah"
Come back here when you own your GTR, take a picture with it, and meet us on the track!
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="6" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td nowrap="nowrap"> RiceEater
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</td> </tr> </tbody></table> <!-- / user info --><!-- message, attachments, sig --><!-- message --> Well that's the difference between the Nissan GTR driver and the Porsche driver, when they park their cars in the garage.
Nissan GTR drivers don't care it's an ugly POS, lacking a racing history (I don't remember seeing it winning any Lemans races). It's one hell of a car on Gran Turismo and during the drifting competitions and hot import nights. Ummm... yeah, no thanks. I'm not spending any amount of money on a car that has such a history.
Go look up Porsche's racing stats: 28,000 racing victories with major wins with the 911. And don't even try to say: it's what the car does today. The 997 RSR and Cup cars have been racing from day one of their development. As kids, we've known about this rich history and have wanted a 911. Not many GTR owners can say the same.
Lastly, it's a matter of preference, not ignorance, that we choose not to like the GTR. I'll make a bet with you. Try posting your lame post below in Lambotalk.com, Ferrarichat.com, etc. See how they react. It won't be pretty.
Nissan does 7:38, and it's videotaped. Then sport auto mag has Von Saurma take a GTR and get it done in 7:54! Hmmm... quite a difference. They plan to retest it next year with a REAL production vehicle.
Lexus does it in 7:15 with their LFA concept! BMW M3 can lap faster than a Carrera S! z06 does it in 7:42 sec!
All of these ridiculous claims have been proven FALSE! All done for and by MARKETING!
Fanboys, non-owners, and haters love these media reports because it's all they got. They are walking advertisements for these companies.
6speed is a community of enthusiasts, in where a large majority of us OWN our cars and discuss. Sorry if you take offense to us not recognizing you or your opinion, but we have yet to see any value that any low posting, non-owner has to offer.
All we've seen from you guys is "I drove my friend's THIS, my dad's THAT, my cousin's THIS is faster than THAT on Gran Turismo 4 for PS3, blah blah blah"
Come back here when you own your GTR, take a picture with it, and meet us on the track!
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="6" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td nowrap="nowrap"> RiceEater
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</td> </tr> </tbody></table> <!-- / user info --><!-- message, attachments, sig --><!-- message --> Well that's the difference between the Nissan GTR driver and the Porsche driver, when they park their cars in the garage.
Nissan GTR drivers don't care it's an ugly POS, lacking a racing history (I don't remember seeing it winning any Lemans races). It's one hell of a car on Gran Turismo and during the drifting competitions and hot import nights. Ummm... yeah, no thanks. I'm not spending any amount of money on a car that has such a history.
Go look up Porsche's racing stats: 28,000 racing victories with major wins with the 911. And don't even try to say: it's what the car does today. The 997 RSR and Cup cars have been racing from day one of their development. As kids, we've known about this rich history and have wanted a 911. Not many GTR owners can say the same.
Lastly, it's a matter of preference, not ignorance, that we choose not to like the GTR. I'll make a bet with you. Try posting your lame post below in Lambotalk.com, Ferrarichat.com, etc. See how they react. It won't be pretty.
Your disdain for the GTR is duly noted.. I notice you like to call this car an "ugly POS" whenever given the chance. You have pegged yourself as a "marque guy" and not a "car guy" at all...... so to me -- your comments are equally as worthless.
I believe the Bugatti Veyron has absolutely zero racing heritage too but I don't hear you dissing that car... why not? It's ugly , overly heavy --- just like the GTR but..... oooooh but I get it -- because it costs 4X what your car costs -- you have no basis for any arguments...
I suggest you incorporate more fiber into your diet -- it is affecting your open-mindedness.
Oh yes -- and those black things on the right and left sides of your eyes are called blinders in case you were wondering.
Last edited by Dr J; Apr 10, 2008 at 11:34 AM.
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Well, at least you've admitted that your opinion is worthless. I never offered my opinion on the car, I havn't driven one. I did see one and sat in it (right hand drive) at the Washington Auto Show (before the show was open to the public, photos attached) My opinion would only be on its looks, to me it looks like a typical Japanese vehicle. Status has nothing to do with it, its called credibility. We just get tired of the trolls coming through here every few months (last year it was the Z06). We don't mind the competition, I'm all for it. But damn, the car hasn't been purchased or driven by anyone in the U.S. yet. And purchased is the operative word here.
I think the biggest difference is that a majority of 6speed members could go out and buy a Z06 or a Gtr, but we choose not to. There are a lot of things to consider when you PAY for a vehicle that is closing in on 6 figures. If and when you do that one day, you'll know that it is a lot harder to stroke a check for 80k for a Nissan, than stroking a 100k check for a Porsche. I think if you get that opportunity one day, my words will come back to haunt you. Good luck.
I think the biggest difference is that a majority of 6speed members could go out and buy a Z06 or a Gtr, but we choose not to. There are a lot of things to consider when you PAY for a vehicle that is closing in on 6 figures. If and when you do that one day, you'll know that it is a lot harder to stroke a check for 80k for a Nissan, than stroking a 100k check for a Porsche. I think if you get that opportunity one day, my words will come back to haunt you. Good luck.
I would have a harder time writing the check for the Porsche, simply because of the terrible depreciation and resale value of the car. ****...you can buy a nice 996 Turbo for around $60k. Just the money lost in depreciation alone could have gotten someone a GT-R, or a car in that relative price range lol. Who's fool are you for saying something like that? Also, there's way more technology/value into the Nissan, regardless of your reasoning, or what badge is on the car. The Porsche is a great car, but are you really getting every penny you are paying for in return? As you seem to imply. I can't justify the 60k price difference between the two, no matter what aspect of the car I'm looking at...unless I could easily afford a $130k car. And even then, each car has its place, as I mentioned in my earlier post. I'm sorry that your holy opinion doesn't fit my bill. You're the one that started this particular debate...so expect to be served.
</O
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Your disdain for the GTR is duly noted.. I notice you like to call this car an "ugly POS" whenever given the chance. You have pegged yourself as a "marque guy" and not a "car guy" at all...... so to me -- your comments are equally as worthless.
I believe the Bugatti Veyron has absolutely zero racing heritage too but I don't hear you dissing that car... why not? It's ugly , overly heavy --- just like the GTR but..... oooooh but I get it -- because it costs 4X what your car costs -- you have no basis for any arguments...
I suggest you incorporate more fiber into your diet -- it is affecting your open-mindedness.
Oh yes -- and those black things on the right and left sides of your eyes are called blinders in case you were wondering.
I believe the Bugatti Veyron has absolutely zero racing heritage too but I don't hear you dissing that car... why not? It's ugly , overly heavy --- just like the GTR but..... oooooh but I get it -- because it costs 4X what your car costs -- you have no basis for any arguments...
I suggest you incorporate more fiber into your diet -- it is affecting your open-mindedness.
Oh yes -- and those black things on the right and left sides of your eyes are called blinders in case you were wondering.
Last edited by timeattack07gt; Apr 10, 2008 at 12:00 PM.
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No..it would not be harder for me to write a check for a 70k dollar Nissan, versus a 100k Porsche (more like 130k+ for Turbo lol). Why? Because I don't get off on owning a "Porsche", nor am I nieve enough to automatically assume that since it's a Porsche, I'm getting my moneys worth...unlike you. I would have a harder time writing the check for the Porsche, simply because of the terrible depreciation and resale value of the car. ****...you can buy a nice 996 Turbo for around $60k. Just the money lost in depreciation alone could have gotten someone a GT-R, or a car in that relative price range lol. Who's fool are you for saying something like that? Also, there's way more technology/value into the Nissan, regardless of your reasoning, or what badge is on the car. The Porsche is a great car, but are you really getting every penny you are paying for in return? As you seem to imply. I can't justify the 60k price difference between the two, no matter what aspect of the car I'm looking at...unless I could easily afford a $130k car. And even then, each car has its place, as I mentioned in my earlier post. I'm sorry that your holy opinion doesn't fit my bill. You're the one that started this particular debate...so expect to be served.
I would have a harder time writing the check for the Porsche, simply because of the terrible depreciation and resale value of the car. ****...you can buy a nice 996 Turbo for around $60k. Just the money lost in depreciation alone could have gotten someone a GT-R, or a car in that relative price range lol. Who's fool are you for saying something like that? Also, there's way more technology/value into the Nissan, regardless of your reasoning, or what badge is on the car. The Porsche is a great car, but are you really getting every penny you are paying for in return? As you seem to imply. I can't justify the 60k price difference between the two, no matter what aspect of the car I'm looking at...unless I could easily afford a $130k car. And even then, each car has its place, as I mentioned in my earlier post. I'm sorry that your holy opinion doesn't fit my bill. You're the one that started this particular debate...so expect to be served.Last edited by 9Eleven; Apr 10, 2008 at 12:15 PM.
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Buddy, the direction of your arguement makes little sense to me. "If and when you do that one day, you'll know that it is a lot harder to stroke a check for 80k for a Nissan, than stroking a 100k check for a Porsche." What's your reasoning for this anway, or is it just ignorance? I already explained why I didn't agree with this statement. Oh, and thank you for correcting my spelling...as you seem to like to pick apart anything I say, and use it as a defense. Also, it's pretty obvious that in most cases you wont get "return" in a vehicle...what would you rather lose though, 25k in 4 years or 60k dollars in the same time period? I rest my case.
Last edited by timeattack07gt; Apr 10, 2008 at 12:23 PM.