^^^ Like I said...

 

That's not really what I was getting at. And anyways racing isnt going to prove anything, because there wont be a GT-R in any Porsche FIA class, because there is no way to make that chassis and engine ayout competitive. They'll have to go tube frame like the JCGT cars which leaves only Rolex, Speed GT, and GT1.

Unlikely we see much of any Porsche vs Nissan in real races, and even then it has little to nothing to do with the street cars. A tube frame car built from the ground up shares little to NO parts with the street version.

Let's face it, Porsche is the #1 seller of race cars in the world, the GT-R has no chance of changing that. Imagine a racing series with 3800 lbs at the minimum weight.

 

The definition of fun for many guys is a car you can toss around, heel toe, and feel like you are controlling everything, not the gizmos and lights flashing to get you around. Which is why the E36, GT3, Lotus, etc are so highly esteemed, because they seperate the boys from the men, and if you are fast in one, it's because you are a heck of a good driver. They develope the driver at the same time. So there will likey be a discrepancy in what you consider fun and what others consider fun. Paddle shifts are fun on the mountain roads, not the track IMO.

HAVE YOU DRIVEN YOUR CAR IN A DE WHILE STOCK?????? Or are all of your scary assessments based on this 700 hp car?

 

Yes I have. I have also driven a 5-speed 245HP Cayman (very fun, not scary at all) on several tracks. Great track car. Have also driven Cayman S stock on track and my E60 M5 on lots of tracks.

Scary is relative and subjective. I am now totally comfortable doing 142MPH (real GPS speed) down main straight in my TT. Some folks would call that scary. Doing <2:06 around Thill (although not impressive to real serious dudes), would scare a lot of people.

It took me 3-4 track days to beat my Cayman (non-S) times at Thunderhill with my 997TT. Why? The power (even stock) is intimidating (to me-- again, maybe I not manly enough). There is a fundamental difference between a momentum car, where you are WOT almost all the time you are on the throttle and a car where you need more finesse with the loud pedal.

What's your point? Fun is subjective too, isn't it? I have fun with lots of cars. Is there a problem with that?

Right now, I'm having the most fun with the GT-R. Why? I don't know. Maybe I have a short attention span. The car just doesn't cease to amaze me.

Am I saying folks should sell their Turbos and get one? Not necessarily.

 

Chrisn - enjoy the car in good health. It has nothing to do with how much hair you have on your *****. You are enjoying a car that you wanted to enjoy and it produced exactly and then some of what you were expecting.

I am selling my Turbo and getting a Prius

 

You are saying that even in stock trim the power was intimidating yet you go and add 700 hp and a street suspension??? Does this not seem bass ackwards even to you??

I understand you may not have built the car for the track, just liked to track the car, but how then can you give an evaluation of a car you are scared of and woudnt even utilize in stock form and went to add 700 hp and probably using even less than stock power?

I just want you to understand how unrealistic this evaluation is.

 

For the great information provided, this thread should be made a sticky so anyone considering adding a GT-R to their garage could see the truth of the matter. Yes, weight is this car's major problem, next to its extremely unattractive and awkward appearance.

One of my biggest disappointments about the Turbo is the 3500 weight, and the GT-R outweighs it by 2 adult passengers! I will give Chris the benefit of the doubt, but remain extremely skeptical that any car coming near the 4000 lbs mark (grin, VERY slight exaggeration) could meet the criteria of "fun." Fast, yes, fun, don't think so.

I wonder what Nissan engineers were thinking? Were they so blinded by their sole guiding light, the tail light of the Turbo, that they forgot what this guy Colin Chapman has taught us?

It shudders me to think that for the same budget, Chris could have:
1. GT-2 (oh my God)
2. Turbo and 996 GT3
3. Turbo and Lotus
1 would make him the envy of 99% of sports car fans, 2 would make many lust; a perfect combination of turbo supercar daily driver plus NA engine track car, 3 gives an extremely interesting light weight car some consider even more "fun" (a foreign word to 4000 lbs cars) than the GT3.

Chris, you appear to be a knowledgeable car guy and your budget is too good to settle for a car that is just "good for the money" (here's that deadly qualification again). The GT-R shares a similar engine to your Turbo, is way too heavy, and looks plainly and simply, ugly. Unload it immediately while you could still break even (just don't let potential buyers read any thing from this thread ); it's not going to stay above MSRP for long.

 

The Perfect track car, now there's an idea for a thread. In fact I think I'll start one.


I' put it in the GT3 section.

 

To throw a little more gas on the fire:

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...column?cid=259

 

I was thinking in terms of something like the Nurburgring 24, but you are correct, now that I think about it, the two makes aren't likely to go head to head in a bona fide race. Lucky for Nissan! Actually, the second part of my response was not really a response to what you had said in the quotes, I was just spouting off at the mouth. It seems like there are a lot of folks who love to hate Porsches for whatever reasons, and they seem to be hoping the GTR will be Porsche's downfall. But, as you said, there will be no change in the status quo, unless Porsche decides to start making blenders instead of cars.

 

Hey guys.

Thunderhill was recently repaved. From what ihave heard people who were flying before the repavement - compare to now- they are 2 seconds faster!

My best lap on thill with ****ty falkens 300 thread rated tires ( the TT is my DD so i need tires to last) i can manage 2:02's-2:03's the last time i went. With the new repayment i hope i can get to flat 2's. I think a set of PS2's will get me there, anyone want to sponsor me the tires so we can settle this all and for once ?

Only mods i had then was stock suspension- aggresive alingment. Pagid Orange pads ( i have yellows now, i think i can break deeper wit these- i feel a lot more confident) ...Upsolute flash/Evoms DV's / k&n filter/ straight pipes.... thats it ....i send one of my traqmate data to chris so he can look over it ...

I would love to get with chris and do a track day together to put this to rest.....but i'll have to check my schedule first.


p.s. No hating on the gtr its a great car. To each their own. I pefer to do the driving then being driven. That said, if i had the money to blow i would get both ...and make my TT a lethal track weapon.

 

So if you could do 2:00 in your car on PS2, you could probably do mid 1:50's in that monster 997 TT on MPSC.

Gives an idea of the relative speed. Really hard to tell until you get to the advanced drivers what the real deal is.

 

700hp 997 tt is slower around a track like thunderhill than stock? I think your an idiot

 

PEOPLE! Enough already. Considering, price, speed, laptimes, we all know which is the better car. It's the M3. HELLO??? A real backseat. Don't you read Car and Driver? Sheesh.

The GTR is newer so it will be faster. Wait a few months and the 911TT with PDK will be faster, then the Spec V will come out, Then a redisigned TT then on and on and on.. blah blah blah.

If you want feedback, endless learning experience, respect for machinery, forget the GTR, TT, or GT3. Do trackdays on a sportbike. (Ducati 1098's for you 6speeders). Your understanding of tire feel, suspension and handling will determine whether or not you're going home or going to the hospital.

 

Interesting and nice write up.