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"Fantastic 4" ~ e92 M3 vs RS4 vs C63 vs IS-F

 
  #31  
Old 08-24-2008, 09:17 PM
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LOL

What you meant to say was "I'm out classed and out gunned so I better pretend like I can't read so that this madness stops!!"

Maybe I should help YOU understand...it doesn't matter if I catch the M3 at 2k, 3k, 4k or 5k rpm, I will still slowly walk it. Why you ask? Because of the exact point you are trying to make...the IS-F makes MORE power in its powerband than the M3 makes in its powerband. Can you understand that this is what I've been saying all along????

I do not have IS-F friends around the United States, another line that barely deserves a response. If you want to talk about the WORLD'S AUTOMOTIVE press then please, for the LOVE OF GOD, pick up a magazine and read the comparo's b/w the M3 and the IS-F...it's CLEAR that the IS-F is the faster car in each one of them!!!!!!

Are you done yet? You really are out out of your league here...
Peter

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
Wow this post is practically unreadable. A shame I am wasting my time with you but it appears you need help.

The only way you are walking an M3 is if you catch it at 2k rpm and you hit the gas. If the M3 is in its powerband you aren't walking it because YOU ARENT MAKING MORE POWER. What don't you get? I suppose I can theoretically walk a single turbo supra if I am at 6000 rpm and he is at 2000 and spools at 4700.

As I said, feel free to arrange a run. I am sure you know ISF owners, find one in Orange County that feels up to the task. You are soooo confident the ISF is faster, I will be glad to get you back into reality. You did not choose the better car, the M3 is universally accepted as the better all around car. Perhaps what you meant to say is the ISF is better to you, subjective. The world's automotive press disagrees.
 
  #32  
Old 08-24-2008, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by houstonT View Post
LOL

What you meant to say was "I'm out classed and out gunned so I better pretend like I can't read so that this madness stops!!"

Maybe I should help YOU understand...it doesn't matter if I catch the M3 at 2k, 3k, 4k or 5k rpm, I will still slowly walk it. Why you ask? Because of the exact point you are trying to make...the IS-F makes MORE power in its powerband than the M3 makes in its powerband. Can you understand that this is what I've been saying all along????

I do not have IS-F friends around the United States, another line that barely deserves a response. If you want to talk about the WORLD'S AUTOMOTIVE press then please, for the LOVE OF GOD, pick up a magazine and read the comparo's b/w the M3 and the IS-F...it's CLEAR that the IS-F is the faster car in each one of them!!!!!!

Are you done yet? You really are out out of your league here...
Peter
Can you understand that what I am saying is the M3 is making more in its powerband?

Post your ISF dyno please and the conditions at the time if you would. I would like to see your torque curve especially.

Another issue would be gearing as well. The manual is not geared as close as the 7 speed, increasing torque multiplication for the DCT car.

It is CLEAR to me that the M3 is the faster and better car in each one. The M3 has won every comparison it has been in except for one. Perhaps you need glasses? One thing that is clear, the ISF has yet to win a comparison, it is always behind the M3 and C63. Pick up your magazines again, or the articles posted online.

Poor guy, if I am out of my league you can't even play.
 
  #33  
Old 08-25-2008, 05:53 AM
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Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
Wow this post is practically unreadable. A shame I am wasting my time with you but it appears you need help.

The only way you are walking an M3 is if you catch it at 2k rpm and you hit the gas. If the M3 is in its powerband you aren't walking it because YOU ARENT MAKING MORE POWER. What don't you get? I suppose I can theoretically walk a single turbo supra if I am at 6000 rpm and he is at 2000 and spools at 4700.

As I said, feel free to arrange a run. I am sure you know ISF owners, find one in Orange County that feels up to the task. You are soooo confident the ISF is faster, I will be glad to get you back into reality. You did not choose the better car, the M3 is universally accepted as the better all around car. Perhaps what you meant to say is the ISF is better to you, subjective. The world's automotive press disagrees.
It is accepted as the better car with archaic 2 piston and 1 piston brakes. Dont go by everything the magazines say, go out and test drive an ISF snd tell me it isnt on par with an M3. I used to despise lexus and never aspired to own one until the ISF. I think the new M3's are great cars but pound for pound hp for hp they do not outshine the ISF. In addition let me know how you feel after a few yrs when M3 engines start exploding like the e46 M's and the ISF keeps marching on to 200Kmiles.
 
  #34  
Old 08-25-2008, 08:00 AM
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I understand clearly what you are saying, unfortunately, what you are saying is wrong. Can you understand that?

I will post my dyno sheet for you tonight...

I understand gearing, again, the 2 M3's I ran didn't take the time to speak to me about getting spanked, so I have no clue if they were manual or auto.

Now, since you want to magazine race, let's do it... Please keep in mind that the ONLY topic at hand is which car is faster, as you will see, even the magazines know the ISF is faster. In some cases, the M3 is as quick, but not as fast... Also, about the ONLY benefit to magazine tests is same day, same conditions, same test equipment, all things equal:

Motor Trend:
ISF vs. M3 vs. C63
ISF traps 113.4
M3 traps 111.3
ISF FASTER

Car and Driver (obviously a well known BMW biased mag):
ISF vs. M3
ISF traps 114
M3 traps 113
ISF FASTER

Road and Track:
ISF vs. M3 vs. C63 vs. RS4
ISF traps 113.8
M3 traps 110.4

This is just the major US magazines as I don't have time to research the European ones. If you have some free time, look up EVO, CAR, Auto, and others that aren't as popular in this country. Now, are you done yet? I don't think you could look any worse than you do right now... Is that CLEAR enough for you?

NEXT... LOL

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
Can you understand that what I am saying is the M3 is making more in its powerband?

Post your ISF dyno please and the conditions at the time if you would. I would like to see your torque curve especially.

Another issue would be gearing as well. The manual is not geared as close as the 7 speed, increasing torque multiplication for the DCT car.

It is CLEAR to me that the M3 is the faster and better car in each one. The M3 has won every comparison it has been in except for one. Perhaps you need glasses? One thing that is clear, the ISF has yet to win a comparison, it is always behind the M3 and C63. Pick up your magazines again, or the articles posted online.

Poor guy, if I am out of my league you can't even play.
 
  #35  
Old 08-25-2008, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by houstonT View Post
I understand clearly what you are saying, unfortunately, what you are saying is wrong. Can you understand that?

I will post my dyno sheet for you tonight...

I understand gearing, again, the 2 M3's I ran didn't take the time to speak to me about getting spanked, so I have no clue if they were manual or auto.

Now, since you want to magazine race, let's do it... Please keep in mind that the ONLY topic at hand is which car is faster, as you will see, even the magazines know the ISF is faster. In some cases, the M3 is as quick, but not as fast... Also, about the ONLY benefit to magazine tests is same day, same conditions, same test equipment, all things equal:

Motor Trend:
ISF vs. M3 vs. C63
ISF traps 113.4
M3 traps 111.3
ISF FASTER

Car and Driver (obviously a well known BMW biased mag):
ISF vs. M3
ISF traps 114
M3 traps 113
ISF FASTER

Road and Track:
ISF vs. M3 vs. C63 vs. RS4
ISF traps 113.8
M3 traps 110.4

This is just the major US magazines as I don't have time to research the European ones. If you have some free time, look up EVO, CAR, Auto, and others that aren't as popular in this country. Now, are you done yet? I don't think you could look any worse than you do right now... Is that CLEAR enough for you?

NEXT... LOL
Well magazine racing it is.

Here is a list of performance figures:

1/4 mile time and speed:
  • Nissan GT-R: 11.6s @ 120.9 [(Edmunds)
  • Mercedes C63 AMG: 12.3s @ 116 mph (C&D)
  • Porsche 997S: 12.3s @ 114.8 mph (R&T)
  • BMW E92 M3: 12.5s @ 114.8 mph (R&T)
  • BMW E92 M3 M-DCT: 12.6 @ 113.2 mph (MT)
  • BMW E90 M3: 12.6 @ 113mph (C&D)
  • Lexus IS-F: 12.7s @ 114 mph (C&D)
  • BMW E90 M3: 12.7s @ 111.3mph (MT)
  • Audi R8: 12.7 @ 111 mph (R&T)
  • Audi RS4: 12.8 @ 109 mph (R&T)
  • BMW E92 M3: 12.9 @ 111 mph (C&D)
  • Porsche 997S: 13.0 @ 113 mph (Automobile A)
  • Lexus IS-F: 13.0s @ 112 mph (MT)
  • Audi RS4: 13.1 @ 111.5 mph (AutoCar)
From what I see, the cars are pretty closely matched. From the numbers and from your own numbers the manual M3 and ISF are pretty close. What upsets it is the DCT M3 which is quicker in the 1/4 and from a roll. It is simply geared shorter and shifts faster.

The data does not support your comment of the ISF making more power or the ISF being faster. All it shows is that the manual sedan (heavier) and ISF are so close that any little variable can upset the winner. The DCT coupe is faster than the ISF, period. Hope it sinks in.

Oh, where did the ISF place in those comparisons? No need to answer, behind the M3 each and every time.
 

Last edited by CURI0; 08-25-2008 at 03:05 PM.
  #36  
Old 08-25-2008, 03:53 PM
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I guess you aren't that versed in "car lingo" so let me help educate you. ALL ALONG the arguement has been:

Which car is faster?

1. My two races prove that the IS-F is faster.
2. The magazine results I posted prove the IS-F is faster.
3. YOUR OWN data posted proves the IS-F is faster!

Look at the trap speeds buddy!

Cars 101:

ET - measure of how quick a car is
MPH (Trap Speed) - measure of how FAST a car is

Again, the IS-F is faster. As for the M3 winning in C&D, DUHHHHH, did you think a BMW would lose anything in C&D?

Now, what next? To be honest, I'm having fun here, you're making it wayyyyyy to easy... LOL

Peter
p.s. ok, in all reality, you are correct on ONE issue the two cars are VERYYYYYY closely matched.......with the IS-F being quicker 99% of the time and the IS-F being faster 100% of the time...
 
  #37  
Old 08-25-2008, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by houstonT View Post
I guess you aren't that versed in "car lingo" so let me help educate you. ALL ALONG the arguement has been:

Which car is faster?

1. My two races prove that the IS-F is faster.
2. The magazine results I posted prove the IS-F is faster.
3. YOUR OWN data posted proves the IS-F is faster!

Look at the trap speeds buddy!

Cars 101:

ET - measure of how quick a car is
MPH (Trap Speed) - measure of how FAST a car is

Again, the IS-F is faster. As for the M3 winning in C&D, DUHHHHH, did you think a BMW would lose anything in C&D?

Now, what next? To be honest, I'm having fun here, you're making it wayyyyyy to easy... LOL

Peter
p.s. ok, in all reality, you are correct on ONE issue the two cars are VERYYYYYY closely matched.......with the IS-F being quicker 99% of the time and the IS-F being faster 100% of the time...
Oh my gosh, so many big words and I have no idea of their meaning.

Trap speed? What is that? Beyond my level of comprehension.

What my data showed is the HIGHEST trap speeds have been achieved with the M3. You are pulling the rug out from under your own feet.

Did the M3 only win in Car and Driver? Have you found a comparison the ISF has won yet? I'll give you some time, that is going to be a hell of a search.

Personally, your video of you jumping an M3 means nothing to me. If an M3 got the jump, the exact same thing would have happened. The professional videos I have seen have showed the M3 outhandling and pulling the ISF, like the bestmotoring one.

Anyway, maybe someday we will be able to meet up. Unlikely of course, but who knows. I'll see if I can get an ISF to run my DCT coupe sometime, I don't know any ISF owners in my area.
 

Last edited by CURI0; 08-25-2008 at 04:29 PM.
  #38  
Old 08-25-2008, 04:45 PM
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Awwwwwwww, the sound of you BOWING OUT! Your data is WORTHLESS for the primary fact that you pulled the BEST you could find out of the magazines with attention to track, weather, conditions, etc... My data was worthwhile b/c my data reflected head to head tests of these cars on the SAME day, SAME track, SAME weather, SAME conditions, SAME equipment, etc...hence the conclusion that...the IS-F is indeed faster. Your data was as pointless as me posting that a guy at MIR trapped 115.8 in his IS-F bone stock... Sure it's faster than the 114.x you posted but the conditions were too different for it to be relevant. Again, you are out of your league here buddy...

As for comparison tests...that is NOT the topic of the conversation, the issue is simply....which car is FASTER...I think it's BLATANTLY evident by this thread that the IS-F is indeed the FASTER car. Judging by the PM's I've gotten begging for me to lay off this "poor soul" in the thread I think it's safe to assume that everyone else reading sees the same FACTS I do...

Now go play in the sandbox and leave the big kids alone...

Peter

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post

What my data showed is the HIGHEST trap speeds have been achieved with the M3. You are pulling the rug out from under your own feet.

Did the M3 only win in Car and Driver? Have you found a comparison the ISF has won yet? I'll give you some time, that is going to be a hell of a search.
 
  #39  
Old 08-25-2008, 05:20 PM
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Curio, I seriously would step down from this match. I really don't think you know who you are battling with on this one.

p.s. Peter, hi from supraforums!
 
  #40  
Old 08-25-2008, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by houstonT View Post
Awwwwwwww, the sound of you BOWING OUT! Your data is WORTHLESS for the primary fact that you pulled the BEST you could find out of the magazines with attention to track, weather, conditions, etc... My data was worthwhile b/c my data reflected head to head tests of these cars on the SAME day, SAME track, SAME weather, SAME conditions, SAME equipment, etc...hence the conclusion that...the IS-F is indeed faster. Your data was as pointless as me posting that a guy at MIR trapped 115.8 in his IS-F bone stock... Sure it's faster than the 114.x you posted but the conditions were too different for it to be relevant. Again, you are out of your league here buddy...

As for comparison tests...that is NOT the topic of the conversation, the issue is simply....which car is FASTER...I think it's BLATANTLY evident by this thread that the IS-F is indeed the FASTER car. Judging by the PM's I've gotten begging for me to lay off this "poor soul" in the thread I think it's safe to assume that everyone else reading sees the same FACTS I do...

Now go play in the sandbox and leave the big kids alone...

Peter
The topic is the one you set, I see. Perhaps you need to re-read your past posts?

You are never going to get it so it does not matter. A DCT car has to be tested against an ISF, at which point the ISF will be pulled in a straight line in addition to every other aspect the M3 trounces it in.

The dyno numbers are roughly the same, the weight is slightly in the M3's favor, the shift times are faster, it is relatively simple to figure out. What is blatantly evident is you ignore the facts you want and present only those you want to see. It is too bad your critical thinking skills are so weak. Lighter, same if not more power, faster shifts, closer gearing, the DCT M3 pulls. Manual is a drivers race practically.

You are bragging about the ISF having under a 1 mph higher trap speed against the manual 6 speed sedan (heavier) when tested head to head? And the M3 was still ahead at the 1/4 mark?

Your position has been the ISF makes more power, haha, what a joke! Let me know when the ISF wins a comparo or is tested with a 115 mph trap speed.

As for bowing out, I mean whats next, you call me a stupid head and throw something at me until I say the ISF is faster? You have your position, I have mine. It is too bad you can't swallow your pride, no matter what the M3 is the better all around car. I seriously expected better quality posts from you not blatant Toyota fanboism.
 

Last edited by CURI0; 08-25-2008 at 06:19 PM.
  #41  
Old 08-25-2008, 09:08 PM
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JP, hey bro! I do think CURI0 is now in a battle to save face in front of the whole 6speed community. From numerous PM's to messages, the community is truly

In an effort to discredit me, CURI0 is blaming me for all those things that he is guilty of yet fails to see the simple, basic premise of my posts...the IS-F IS FASTER!!!!!! LOL Muddying the waters doesn't work when you're amongst a group of people that can comprehend beyond the 5th grade level, from what I see here, you are used to playing in the sand box...

I haven't ignored any facts, simply posted the facts to support my arguement. I'm not mad at you b/c you feel the need to defend your $75k mistake, nor am I mad at you b/c of the attitude phenomenon that seems prevalent in your posts. I'm still scratching my head as to why I haven't inherited/acquired (pick your word) that same blatant "******baggery" that goes with owning a BMW? You attempt to call me a "troll" when I've owned in VERY RECENT times an M3, 335i and still own an X5. You try to somehow infer that b/c I own a 950+ HP Supra that I don't know what a powerband is when in reality the powerband on my Supra is more efficient and powerful than anything you've ever experienced. Then you resort to posting numbers from independent tests that have NOTHING to do with taking an objective and "arms length" view of what defines FAST and the phrase "all things equal". Again, it's blatantly obvious that you have "keyboard picked on" the wrong person, it's time to move on champ...

I'm sorry you made the decision you made...it's obvious that this bothers you to no end and I recommend you simply move on...while I'm having fun here, you are truly bothered, and that to me is ...

In all honesty, I think the RS4, M3, IS-F and C63 are ALL great cars. I have driven all of them except for the C63 (which I did see in person and get to ride in) and I think I bought the better car. Even if you disagree, atleast I have proof that I bought the FASTER car (less the C63 of course)...

Peter
p.s. I have read up on and agree that the DCT is a phenominal transmission, I would LOVE to run a DCT equipped M3 for fun, my offer still stands...

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
The topic is the one you set, I see. Perhaps you need to re-read your past posts?

You are never going to get it so it does not matter. A DCT car has to be tested against an ISF, at which point the ISF will be pulled in a straight line in addition to every other aspect the M3 trounces it in.

The dyno numbers are roughly the same, the weight is slightly in the M3's favor, the shift times are faster, it is relatively simple to figure out. What is blatantly evident is you ignore the facts you want and present only those you want to see. It is too bad your critical thinking skills are so weak. Lighter, same if not more power, faster shifts, closer gearing, the DCT M3 pulls. Manual is a drivers race practically.

You are bragging about the ISF having under a 1 mph higher trap speed against the manual 6 speed sedan (heavier) when tested head to head? And the M3 was still ahead at the 1/4 mark?

Your position has been the ISF makes more power, haha, what a joke! Let me know when the ISF wins a comparo or is tested with a 115 mph trap speed.

As for bowing out, I mean whats next, you call me a stupid head and throw something at me until I say the ISF is faster? You have your position, I have mine. It is too bad you can't swallow your pride, no matter what the M3 is the better all around car. I seriously expected better quality posts from you not blatant Toyota fanboism.
 

Last edited by houstonT; 08-25-2008 at 09:10 PM.
  #42  
Old 08-25-2008, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by houstonT View Post
JP, hey bro! I do think CURI0 is now in a battle to save face in front of the whole 6speed community. From numerous PM's to messages, the community is truly

In an effort to discredit me, CURI0 is blaming me for all those things that he is guilty of yet fails to see the simple, basic premise of my posts...the IS-F IS FASTER!!!!!! LOL Muddying the waters doesn't work when you're amongst a group of people that can comprehend beyond the 5th grade level, from what I see here, you are used to playing in the sand box...

I haven't ignored any facts, simply posted the facts to support my arguement. I'm not mad at you b/c you feel the need to defend your $75k mistake, nor am I mad at you b/c of the attitude phenomenon that seems prevalent in your posts. I'm still scratching my head as to why I haven't inherited/acquired (pick your word) that same blatant "******baggery" that goes with owning a BMW? You attempt to call me a "troll" when I've owned in VERY RECENT times an M3, 335i and still own an X5. You try to somehow infer that b/c I own a 950+ HP Supra that I don't know what a powerband is when in reality the powerband on my Supra is more efficient and powerful than anything you've ever experienced. Then you resort to posting numbers from independent tests that have NOTHING to do with taking an objective and "arms length" view of what defines FAST and the phrase "all things equal". Again, it's blatantly obvious that you have "keyboard picked on" the wrong person, it's time to move on champ...

I'm sorry you made the decision you made...it's obvious that this bothers you to no end and I recommend you simply move on...while I'm having fun here, you are truly bothered, and that to me is ...

In all honesty, I think the RS4, M3, IS-F and C63 are ALL great cars. I have driven all of them except for the C63 (which I did see in person and get to ride in) and I think I bought the better car. Even if you disagree, atleast I have proof that I bought the FASTER car (less the C63 of course)...

Peter
p.s. I have read up on and agree that the DCT is a phenominal transmission, I would LOVE to run a DCT equipped M3 for fun, my offer still stands...
The cool thing about this community is people like you are so entertaining. I like how you live in your own reality of picking up only on the things you want to see.

I have no idea what "face" I am trying to save or what PM's you are talking about. Frankly, I could care less, but perhaps you are having trouble dealing with facts and staying on topic?

Let me address your points, but they might be lost on you since I am not going to use a huge smiley after each one. Some people like pictures not words, I understand.

I can't see that I am the one bothered as I don't intend to call you names or a ******bag. People can make their own decision but I really don't think people other than you or I really care that much about an internet pissing match regarding the M3 vs. the ISF.

You are right, they are all great cars. The M3 is the BEST drivers car and all around performance car in its class. The M3 handles, brakes, and accelerates better than just about everything. The only car that can challenge the M3 in a single aspect, straightline speed, is the C63.

What you don't understand is there are several trim levels of M3's. If you are going to compare the ISF to the M3, use the highest performance trim level, the DCT coupe. That is, if you want to see the best straightline numbers. I could argue that an E46 M3 is quicker than a 997 if I only looked at the tip 997, or maybe the cab.

It is fairly obvious you are biased as I can at least admit the cars are on a similar power level (as the dynos show). Frankly, I find it a testament to BMW that they are beating all the cars in their class with the smallest motor. Simply engineering on another level, the ISF motor is a joke in comparison. There is nothing special about Toyota taking their large UR series V8 and sticking it into the IS chassis. Wow, how amazing.

BMW's motor is a more advanced and better built powerplant, period. From forged magnesium-steel connecting rods, aluminum silicon F1 plant sourced block, to iron coated aluminum pistons it is a motor built to a higher standard.

Regarding the troll comment, you obviously need help with the context. As I said, if I go on the ISF forum proclaiming my car as superior and calling out people for a race that is trolling. If no one responds to my attention whoring and then I use that as justification of my car being superior because no one responded that is just plain idiocy. Somehow you think because on M3post no one cared to respond to your "call out" that was somehow strengthening your argument? Come on guy, grow up.

I think they are all great cars as well, and I have driven them all except the ISF coincidentally. I think it is great that Toyota is trying to compete as the added competition is better for all enthusiasts. It is not a car in the class I would consider for myself but its nice for what it is.

I hope we can continue this someday like adults, and I am glad you are up to run a DCT sometime. I am up to run an ISF sometime and hope I get the opportunity. I would still like to get a look at your dyno.
 

Last edited by CURI0; 08-25-2008 at 09:39 PM.
  #43  
Old 08-25-2008, 10:06 PM
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I've been reading here and am quite amazed.
Member houstonT you boast about posting on the E90 AND YOU GET NO TAKERS.
Well as you've said that you think the M5 is not that fast, go ahead and drop the challenge in the M5Board.com. Go to the Dallas section. You will get a response to your challange.

Buddy you think too much of that IS-F.

Ranger
 
  #44  
Old 08-26-2008, 07:45 AM
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Ranger, you need to go back and crawl under that rock you came from. First you show your *** by having NO CLUE what you are talking about in reference to the 1/4 mile video posted for the IS-F. Now, you are putting words into my mouth? Are you kidding? Please show me where I said that the M5 is not that fast. Please quote me directly and reference my post number as if you do, I will immediately back off. So as to help you (it seems you need it), here is my direct quote about the M5:

"As for the M5, it's a $90k car that is NOT in the same class as the F....the F competes directly with the M3, RS4, etc...so comparing the two is pointless. For $30k, the M5 BETTER be MUCH faster..."

Soooooo, Ranger, please do help me here...

Peter

Originally Posted by GT3Ranger View Post
I've been reading here and am quite amazed.
Member houstonT you boast about posting on the E90 AND YOU GET NO TAKERS.
Well as you've said that you think the M5 is not that fast, go ahead and drop the challenge in the M5Board.com. Go to the Dallas section. You will get a response to your challange.

Buddy you think too much of that IS-F.

Ranger
 
  #45  
Old 08-26-2008, 08:02 AM
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Are you a used car salesman? LOL Your new nickname is going to be "side-step" as you continue to divert the attention off your hypocracy so as not to look like such an _ _ _. I need to keep it simple for you as it seems like earlier in the thread when I used CAPS to respond, it only confused you. Let me try another method.

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
The cool thing about this community is people like you are so entertaining. I like how you live in your own reality of picking up only on the things you want to see.
Wrong, that is the EXACT methodology you've employed. When you realized you couldn't find anecdotal proof to prove your point, you chose to start diverting the attention so as not to make you look as bad as you do.

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
I have no idea what "face" I am trying to save or what PM's you are talking about. Frankly, I could care less, but perhaps you are having trouble dealing with facts and staying on topic?
PM's - from 6 other members on this board who have chosen not to post but are LOL at you. They have the intellect to see through your "let me muddy the waters" strategy. I don't think I'm the one with trouble staying on topic.

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
Let me address your points, but they might be lost on you since I am not going to use a huge smiley after each one. Some people like pictures not words, I understand.
My pictures represent me LOL behind the computer as you've made this entirely toooooooo easy.

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
I can't see that I am the one bothered as I don't intend to call you names or a ******bag. People can make their own decision but I really don't think people other than you or I really care that much about an internet pissing match regarding the M3 vs. the ISF.
Agreed, not to mention you've been outmatched here so pack your bags and don't let the door hit you on the way out!

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
You are right, they are all great cars. The M3 is the BEST drivers car and all around performance car in its class. The M3 handles, brakes, and accelerates better than just about everything. The only car that can challenge the M3 in a single aspect, straightline speed, is the C63.
WRONGGGGGGGGGG, let's recap, the IS-F is faster, has better brakes, argueably handles better (although both cars are very close here), has a tranny on par with the M3 (if not better, shift times at 100ms vs the M3 which is documented in the 50-200 ms range), and BLOWS the M3 away when it comes to reliability and quality. If you'd like I can quote the JD Power survey that shows Lexus ranked #1 in the world for the 14th year in a row for quality.

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
What you don't understand is there are several trim levels of M3's. If you are going to compare the ISF to the M3, use the highest performance trim level, the DCT coupe. That is, if you want to see the best straightline numbers. I could argue that an E46 M3 is quicker than a 997 if I only looked at the tip 997, or maybe the cab.
WRONGGGGGGGGGGG again! This is becoming a habit for you! I do understand that there are several different trim levels...for example, I haven't even brought a convertible into this conversation as I know it's a pig... You are also wrong in that the IS-F should be compared to an auto M3 SEDAN (not coupe). Use your own logic here genius!!!!

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
It is fairly obvious you are biased as I can at least admit the cars are on a similar power level (as the dynos show). Frankly, I find it a testament to BMW that they are beating all the cars in their class with the smallest motor. Simply engineering on another level, the ISF motor is a joke in comparison. There is nothing special about Toyota taking their large UR series V8 and sticking it into the IS chassis. Wow, how amazing.
Biased? No, just realistic. I know the cars make "similar power" and have not said anywhere in this thread that they don't. I simply said that the IS-F makes more power. As for the IS-F motor being a joke...I will only say that this "joke" is engineered in such a way that I get better gas economy and actually have TQ! The M3 motor, while it is an engineering marvel, is akin to an S2000. Can you say no TQ?

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
BMW's motor is a more advanced and better built powerplant, period. From forged magnesium-steel connecting rods, aluminum silicon F1 plant sourced block, to iron coated aluminum pistons it is a motor built to a higher standard.
Again, great motor, if you enjoy having to rev to the sky to have any giddyup...again, where is the TQ?????

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
Regarding the troll comment, you obviously need help with the context. As I said, if I go on the ISF forum proclaiming my car as superior and calling out people for a race that is trolling. If no one responds to my attention whoring and then I use that as justification of my car being superior because no one responded that is just plain idiocy. Somehow you think because on M3post no one cared to respond to your "call out" that was somehow strengthening your argument? Come on guy, grow up.
Is this even worth a response? No, not really...

Originally Posted by CURI0 View Post
I think they are all great cars as well, and I have driven them all except the ISF coincidentally. I think it is great that Toyota is trying to compete as the added competition is better for all enthusiasts. It is not a car in the class I would consider for myself but its nice for what it is.
I recommend you stick to the M3, you've got that BMW mentality...

I hope we can continue this someday like adults, and I am glad you are up to run a DCT sometime. I am up to run an ISF sometime and hope I get the opportunity. I would still like to get a look at your dyno.[/quote]
 

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