well, you also argue that you're applying a ton of HP to only the high end of the rpm range where the engine is spinning like crazy and more vulnerable, vs the TPC where you could shift sooner and still have gobs of power down low.

on the flip side you could argue that having that much power on the motor all the time will wear it out prematurely.

i have no idea which is right. somebody toss a coin

 

What is the A/F ratio for WOT (wide open throttle) on a stock 3.6 996
------ ~ 12.5-13.5:1

What is the timing set for at WOT on a stock 3.6 996
------ ~ 25-30 degrees depending on load, intake temps, knock activity etc.

What is the normal intake temp on a stock 996 after a few heated runs? ball park hear, i know ambient temps vary.
----- I will have to check my testing logs for this one. We tested in a very hot climate so ambient will be in the 115 degree range.

Now, what are the same number for the EVO kit?
------ AFR w/ EVO 3.6L SC ~ 12:1
------ Timing: Less than that
------ Temps w/ EVO SC- I will have to check the logs from the same day on the stock car from a 115 degree day and get back to you

Does the EVO ECU have the ability to retard and advance timing depending on boost conditions?
------ YES will advance during normal driving and retard under boost / load

Does the EVO ECU have the ability to adjust A/F ratios?
------ YES depending on load and boost

Lastly, are all the engine's safety management features kept in place?
----- YES

 

i think the TPC kit looks good now. and i know it hauls ***

there are some still questions i need cleared up as to how they manage the engine and apply fuel. i do have concerns that they are not able to retard timing at boost with their piggy back. that could be a problem. i also have a concern that the 7th injector would spray more fuel in the center cylinders, with less going to the outer cylinders (although still more that stock). if so, could create some weird stuff going on in there.

conversely, some peope say that bigger injectors cause problems because even though they're managed by the ECU and can flow a ton of fuel, they can't be backed down to stock flow rates and create a very rich condition when driving normally causing overheating in the cylinders. don't know if that's fact or fiction.

why can't EVO just use a roots blower and make me happy. boy if we could get those two companies together we'd have a hell of a kit

 

Wow, thanks for the quick replies Todd.

Do you have the same numbers (A/F and timeing) while idling or low rpm on a stock car and EVO car?

I'd be curious to know how the kit performs whle under normal driving and see if there is an overly rich or abnormal conditon.

 

Fiction, I know that you are just repeating what you have been told but it makes no mechanical sense. If properly managed, larger injectors will operate like the stock injectors. The injectors that we use are not HUGE. They are properly sized for the output of the engine with the supercharger. They are smaller than the injectors on some other P cars being controlled by similar ECU's.

 

back on the suport issue, having the dealer as you're installer is really a big plus. they have some seriously expensive diagnostic computers that most independent shops probalby just can't afford.

Uggghh, big power or reliablity and support. this is worse than tastes great or less filling

 

That's good info Todd. That makes me feel better about the injectors.

Let me know on those idle low speed conditons when you get a chance.

Just curious as to why EVO didn't go with a roots blower. What is the advantage to the one you're using.

 

I left out the afr / timing at idle and low rpm due huge variances depending on load and rpm. Idle #'s are not really important as a car fitted with our SC kit will operate as if it were stock. Normal light, light partial throttle driving the car will operate as f it were stock.

 

Fair enough on those numbers. I'm just looking for stock behavior under normal driving conditons.

So why centrif over roots. Just curious.

 

Me too. I appreciate your non bias feedback on the topic. Personally if I decide to SC I would go Evo Todd's support gives me peace of mind. Plus the installation looks much cleaner

 

Well, the install on the TPC looked pretty good too. You have to take into account that the TPC kit I pictured was a developmental kit used build the final production piece. The actual TPC kit is a little sharper looking with a bigger intercooler.

 

 

No problem with clarification on the injectors.

The roots blower is a good unit. I / we fell that roots blowers have their place on larger displacement engines such as V8’s. There are many reasons we use a centrifugal unit, some of which were mentioned earlier in this discussion. I could write a novel on this topic and will give you more concrete compilation of our theory as well as other respected experts in this fields input as well. It is not a simple answer but one that we made based upon years of practical experience, shared experiences with other tuners and MANY years of working with this new type of engine. I will post more in the AM.

 

both kits look pretty good.



Todd: another question for you... i know this may sound a little rice, but is it possible to get a noisier diverter valve with your setup. i don't know why, but i've been in a turbo or two with blow off valves and it just sounds cool.

Something else I should mention. The EVO kit is very quiet compared to the TPC. The TPC supercharger abolutely howls under WOT. actually sounded kind of cool to me, maybe a bit much for other. You almost can't even tell (by noise) that the EVO is kit is in there.

 

excellent! thanx DOG for your review.

regarding boost load. because tires/drivetrain are rotating a slower speed when the boost comes on with the TPC kit there is more net load on the parts. with the EVO kit the tires/drivetrain are at a higher speed when boost kicks in so the net load is less than the TPC. Just a theory...

maybe you can overdrive the vortec SC so that it will boost higher, sooner and still retain a low peak boost with the appropriate diverters. but maybe the vortec becomes inefficient at super high rpms. hopefully nik can chime in.

again kudos for you report.