996 Turbo / GT2 Turbo discussion on previous model 2000-2005 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo and 911 GT2.

D.I.Y. 996TT Redneck Engine Build Thread.

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Old Nov 4, 2016 | 10:43 PM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by B8_RDC
In the uTube video they appear to do so when hunting for TDC...I'm asking if that is a problem or not

Now specifically when trying to set the timing: Why would this be a bad idea? Well the vanes in the variocam plus would move internally but meet no resistance, lacking the ability to put pressure on external housing actually on the chains, until they hit the max degrees of the other side and contact metal. So rotating backwards could set (bolt down) at an incorrect position.

The point of variocam plus is that the non-compressible oil (controlled by solenoid) is able to adjust the intake cam degrees by applying pressure (or fake "walls) to the internal vanes.

I guess that's the point of the factory tools in that they allow the techs to more-or-less not need the dial gauge setup when setting the timing w/ the engine in the car, as long as they don't spin the crank backwards.
i dont see any way that you could install the timing tools with the motor in the car. simply no room at all to do that.
 
Old Nov 12, 2016 | 07:02 PM
  #137  
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Pulled my passenger side cams off. Pelican refers to the chain guide in question as the "right" side. If the right side is the passenger side then I think I built it correctly and I can't figure out why it is so tight. It does not install upside down either. I guess I will remove the driver side cams to try to swap over the guides to be sure. http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/...05-167-70-M260
 
Old Nov 13, 2016 | 05:24 AM
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right side is passenger side. the question that nags me is why didnt you install everything before timing the cams? the tensioners should be in place before timing starts if i understand the timing process.
 
Old Nov 13, 2016 | 08:40 AM
  #139  
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It had the Stomski tensioners in for timing.
 
Old Nov 13, 2016 | 09:26 PM
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Any chance you have pics of the original configuration that might help you? I find I snap tons of pictures these days so I can be sure when I put things back! Or was your engine hurt so bad that wasn't possible? :-(
 
Old Nov 13, 2016 | 10:23 PM
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Ok I figured it out. It turns out that the passenger side chain is tighter than the drivers side chain which is just a normal quirk with this engine that comes from putting a modern top end on an old aircooled block and not a problem with the chain guides. Looking at the Pelican Parts website I noticed that the two chain tensioner springs have different part numbers. I checked them and sure enough they are different. One tensioner compresses more than the other and I had them mixed up so it wouldn't fit. I must have mixed them up during teardown even though I am organized with plastic bags and labels. They look the same. Just a weird quirk with this engine had me confused.
 
Old Nov 14, 2016 | 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by brnrdtns
Ok I figured it out. It turns out that the passenger side chain is tighter than the drivers side chain which is just a normal quirk with this engine that comes from putting a modern top end on an old aircooled block and not a problem with the chain guides. Looking at the Pelican Parts website I noticed that the two chain tensioner springs have different part numbers. I checked them and sure enough they are different. One tensioner compresses more than the other and I had them mixed up so it wouldn't fit. I must have mixed them up during teardown even though I am organized with plastic bags and labels. They look the same. Just a weird quirk with this engine had me confused.
Any estimate on parts pricing for your build so far? Would be good to know for us who may tackle such a project.
 
Old Nov 14, 2016 | 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by VAGscum
Any estimate on parts pricing for your build so far? Would be good to know for us who may tackle such a project.
Now that I am home free with the main engine I will post up some final thoughts and prices.

Splitting the case: If you just want to do rods this build would be easy and cheaper to do without splitting the case. The main bearings didn't show much wear at 59k and the rear seal can be done as it sits. My IMS bearings were worn but they seem to not be a problem on high mileage cars. New timing chains are nice to have if you do split it to be safe. The stock oil pump is fine as Eddie Bello uses a stock one in his 964. If you track hard you might want a GT3 pump. My understanding is that it pressurizes oil the same as stock but it just has an additional pickup towards the back of the motor. Stock IMS shaft is fine. If you split purchasing the pfixit.com video will help and is totally worth it. Do not spin the long case bolts while tightening. Your bearing surfaces must be immaculately clean when installed. Mark each bolt after you final torque it to save yourself from mistakes and second guessing yourself.

Cylinders: The Stomski press tools are nice but not needed. I did not use any special tools but I advise you to get the Stomski small center ring compressor as well as their circlip injector as this part was a pain in the *** with the hose clamp and my fingers on the circlips. I screwed up a lot until I finally got it. The 997 uses a MLS base gasket but the 996 gasket is just single layer and is a risk to leak. Some use a thin layer of Loctite flange sealant on both sides of the gasket but I went my own way and used Permatex copper spray. Do not drop a circlip into the engine and double check that you did not forget one or you will blow up.

Heads: You must always get your heads surfaced when you take them off because they almost always warp a bit. I advise that you get a valve job. You can just use any reputable shop for this as the valves are similar to other import cars. If you are not having someone port them for you it is easy to take the valves out and smooth the casting flash and blend the transitions with some sanding rolls at the very least. You can learn this skill watching youtube. The finish work on the stock valve pockets is poor so some light porting just to clean this up will really benefit airflow.

Studs: I went the 12mm ARP route but I think 10mm studs can work well if you installed them properly. I advise angle torque for this to optimise the seal. You might be able to over torque some 10mm studs a bit to get away with not heat cycling them at your own risk.

Timing cams: This is a huge obsticle as far as the special tool situation goes. If you don't have anyone with them nearby I think you could get the Stomski dial tool for $800 and just use the factory tensioners for the chains and use some large pliers to hold the cams in place. O normal engine dial degree wheel thing bolted to the crank would work fine in place of a digidix. You should upgrade to 997 lifters. You are supposed to replace the cam bolts each time.

Seals: I used the Wrightwood seal kit from EBS racing. It uses viton orings that I'm reading are better than the factory parts, so this may be the best way to go.

Money spent: I blew my bottom end so I spent more than a normal build would cost but I will list everything and you can add or subtract based upon your situation.

2000 case used shipped
1125 crank used shipped low miles
1125 Pauter rods used shipped (1600 or so new I think) low miles
600 ARP studs from SRM
200 Cometic head gasket SRM
1000 997 pistons rings and liners used low miles
500 oil pump used low miles
800 997 lifters used low miles
120 timing chains
40 oil pump coupler
750 Wrightwood Racing full gasket kit minus head gaskets from EBS Racing
150 nose bearing
200 rod, crank, IMS bearings
25 Loctite 574
10 Yama bond 4
160 2 new intake valves
170 bbi crank pulley
450 stock intake manifold (cracked mine)
100 new rod bolts

Work:
800 or so for stud drill and tap time serts @SRM shop on CNC with heads and cyl housings
150 crank balance micropolish and magnaflux
25 rod magnaflux
400 valve job and head surface
200 cam timing
300 various tools sanding rolls for heads

Grand total of around $11,500. Subtract 5000 for the parts that I ruined and had to replace and that would be close to a typical DIY rebuild with rods and studs. You could save about another 1000 by not splitting the case and installing your own studs with the SRM 12mm kit or 10mm.
 

Last edited by brnrdtns; Feb 25, 2017 at 01:24 AM.
Old Dec 14, 2016 | 07:13 AM
  #144  
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I'm working through the final stages, I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. I put my valve covers on and then realized that my shop had mixed up my exhaust cam sprockets and pump drives so I had to take them back off, swap the sprockets, re align the exhaust cams, clean off the sealant, and install again. I got half of the accessories back on last night. It's a bit of a puzzle remembering how it all goes back. I did take pictures as I tore it down which helps. Drank too many IPAs with 7% alcohol in them and now I have a headache. I suggest sticking with Coors while wrenching.
 
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Last edited by brnrdtns; Dec 14, 2016 at 07:49 AM.
Old Dec 14, 2016 | 07:35 AM
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I love this thread, thanks for sharing - can't wait to see when it's all done.
 
Old Dec 14, 2016 | 08:47 AM
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Love this thead as well! Really want to have a go myself
 
Old Dec 14, 2016 | 10:24 AM
  #147  
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Glad you all like it. I'll get some videos when I run it.
 
Old Dec 14, 2016 | 10:28 AM
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hopefully it will be running soon.
 
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Old Dec 15, 2016 | 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by MariusL
Love this thead as well! Really want to have a go myself
I love this thread as well! Motor no longer in the kitchen, aahhhhh clean room. Lol
Reminds me of my first Porsche build, 20 yrs ago

Keep drinking IPAs or similar, brnrdtns. Life is short...
 
Old Feb 2, 2017 | 07:09 PM
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Any progress on this project? Interested to see how it all went back together and how it runs.
 


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